Having been around the world and seen some of the most awful [ __ ] imaginable, I've also seen some of the best [ __ ] in some of the worst places.
0:09>> So, I have started following up most everything I hear with maybe.
0:15>> When I hear some horrible [ __ ] that happened to kids because of migrants, I say maybe, maybe not. Because someone's got interest in firing you the [ __ ] up.
0:23That's why you get your algorithm getting you so angry. And it's not I'm not I'm not I don't mean to keep picking on Pakistanis or whatever cuz they're getting the algorithm towards us and there's someone spinning if they can keep us hating each other.
0:34>> The [ __ ] bankers are fine.
0:36>> I think there's something to that% what's going on.
0:39>> It's the power and money. You think why would I mean even like voting if that mattered they wouldn't let us do it, >> right?
0:45>> Come on. The bank's not going anywhere.
0:47>> I hate to be cynical but I'm I'm with you on that. You ever I mean look uh I've I think I bought my uh not I'm not not bragging fourth house like a mortgage you're paying the interest the whole time. You're not paying the principal. Why is that?
1:00>> Yeah.
1:01>> It's power.
1:02>> Yeah.
1:02>> Because you don't have a [ __ ] choice.
1:03That's why I mean I'm even here's another rabbit hole. Uh the TSA is in on it. The government's in on it because TSA. Yeah. You have to throw away your water. Why? Because you got to buy more expensive water right over there.
1:12>> Right.
1:13>> And then I got to I got a contract with him. That's it. The t really they're trained to find [ __ ] water you could get through with a gun. That's too much shampoo. Really? Because think about oh my five ounces of shampoo, not the million drones that are going to bring the planes down. Yeah, it's it's racket, man. It's all a racket.
1:31>> I think there's something to that, man.
1:32>> I've been I'm 50. I'm disgruntled.
1:34>> It's that I I hear you. But and also like you've been around the world, too.
1:38>> I keep spitting. I'm officially an old man.
1:40>> N that's all right. You're getting fired up. [laughter] But like this I I've I've thought it for the longest time that like all the left and right they all get dinner at the same steakhouse.
1:49>> Oh, I've seen it. My my first job out of the Navy was working on Capitol Hill.
1:52>> What was that?
1:53>> Uh I was I Well, I initially thought that oh they're just different ideas.
1:57They all care about the country and then you see behind the [ __ ] curtain. Oh, >> I'm going to go make a difference.
2:02>> Uhuh. No, no, you look like I was invited to uh um Bohemian Grove three times >> and I didn't go just cuz I didn't.
2:09>> You didn't go.
2:09>> I totally would. Now I >> wear a GoPro.
2:11>> I didn't know. Oh, dude. I'd love to get in there now. But no, I got I didn't know anything about I'm like, "Yeah, I'd be a cool party." I didn't know I'd be uh potentially a senator. [laughter] >> Who invited you to bo?
2:21>> Uh I was invited by uh musicians through a Democrat senator maybe, but it was seem more because I was new to it. I was out and everyone celebrating like I didn't know anything about that. But then you start to see congressmen uh and then their staffs and you realize that their staffs are leading around the congressman because they're visitors too unless you're a Nancy Pelosi who's been there the whole time and then they run the entire show and then you'll see stuff with the primaries. Eric Swah was a prime example. What happens in these places is you get the young good-looking freshman and then you take them to the
2:49parties and I've been to these parties.
2:51The Bohemian Grove would have been one of them. But then all of a sudden the drinks come out, the drugs come out, the girls come out, the cameras are out. Oh look what you were doing on camera. We got oh hey you're going to do some worsh [ __ ] or we're going to release that. And then all of a sudden they got you and then you're doing then you're you can you be an attack dog for us. You do exactly what we say on TV. I don't care how ridiculous it is. Don't get too powerful, Eric Swallwell. We got Okay, you're out.
3:09>> You ever worry that was going to happen to you?
3:10>> I didn't know at the time. Um but people find dirt on me. I don't need to run for office, right?
3:16>> I don't want that [ __ ] getting out. So uh >> yeah, I uh I just I saw behind it and then you see it's all power. It's all power and money. There's nothing created in DC. The richest uh counties are right there. There's money. There's pol your money uh my money everyone listening their money's there and then nothing's created and we give it to their buddies and they make more missiles we make more tanks we give [ __ ] away and then we make more Would you think we leave [ __ ] in Afghanistan because it's too expensive to bring it like we give a [ __ ] about how expens No we got to build that [ __ ]
3:44again let them have it then we can go destroy it then we can make more bombs to destroy the next [ __ ] we leave like we did in Vietnam like we do every it's the same thing Eisenhower warned about it and we keep doing it because we're burning the books >> that's interesting though because I agree with you 100% but it's also like you've been on the tip of the spear for I I guess essentially like you lived your life to be able to go do that [ __ ] and be in the dangerous places and take the bad people out and everything which is supported by those things. But what you're saying is that they just create a
4:15lot of fat where you just need muscle.
4:17Am I hearing right?
4:18>> So true. Yeah. And it's you it's the self-licking ice cream cone. We got to keep the you got to keep the ice cream on top too. And and and you got to figure they're doing it right. Look at the recruiting. Look at the Marine recruiting. I want to be a [ __ ] Marine. Look at the Marines that are out there right now on the mark or on the on the MW. Uh uh they they want to go fight right now. They I was 28 or whatever 9/11. I will [ __ ] invade Canada right now. Let's do this. I was I remember saying [ __ ] cuz we had to swim in Liberia during the invasion in Iraq. I remember thinking I'm going to miss
4:43Iraq. [ __ ] >> Like that's how bad I want to fight.
4:45You're not going to miss [ __ ] son.
4:46>> What were you doing in Liberia?
4:48>> We had to swim in uh I think Charles Taylor might have been the president and he was like I'm talking straight up cannibalism. Uh yeah, we we had to go in just to secure the em secure a lane for Marines to come in and take the embassy if we needed. And this is cool because this is old school frogman [ __ ] like old UDT underwater demolition team, naval combat demolition units, the naked warriors, men with like swimming in with a knife and udt shirts that catch me, [ __ ] me. Uh swim in, put bombs on stuff like like sort of shipping like come in for an invasion in Normandy or wherever.
5:19So we had to do that which is kind of dope and that's what So we swam. No, that was a funny brief because um we brief everything and some of it we just whatever if if my time is up that's just it. And one of the things as a seal was I don't care about the dangerous marine life. It's just it is what it is. Um like people would say in seal training, aren't you afraid of great whites going to eat you? They're all over. And I said no, I'm not that lucky. A great white wouldn't just kill me. I would finish a four mile swim. He'd [ __ ] grab me and drag me four miles and let me go and I got to do it again. That's what a shark
5:46would do. [laughter] But uh we're getting ready for this um this swim and we're in the brief and the whoever scientist or weatherman he goes moon rises here and here's dangerous marine life. He goes now you're off the west coast of Africa so there's every matte eating shark you can imagine.
6:02They're right there. Uh and as you're swimming and you you shouldn't cuz we're kind of far up the coast but you might run into saltwater crocodiles maneaters 20 ft long. They'll [ __ ] kill you.
6:10Definitely won't run into hippos but if you do they kill more people than anything other than mosquitoes every year. And here's your landing point.
6:16It's called Blackmamba Point. And the reason is because of all the black mambas on this point and they're very aggressive and they'll kill you and and then we're like so then we have a civil war to fight.
6:26>> Okay. So we're the back of an amphib ship. It's like a big Navy ship. The back is a box. It it will it will lower down and they it's called flooding the well deck. So all the water comes in, you put the ships out. So we flood the well deck on I forget what ship it was, but uh they flood it. There's hammerhead sharks swimming in the ship.
6:43>> Oh god.
6:44>> Yeah. And they're not big, but still the thought is their parents are whatever.
6:47So that's so that's kind of the funny [ __ ] So we just we we took the boats and we swam in. I was on the the >> next to the hammerheads.
6:53>> Yeah. Whatever. But it's still the idea that you know I don't want to run into but we get on the beach and I ran into that film crew from Fox. That was just funny. And then that picture >> Oh, that was when that happened. Oh my god.
7:02>> Yeah. I was looking for Jennifer Eckleston and I went up to the guy and I thought and I was like, "Where's Jennifer Eckleston?" And he goes, >> "I think we were on camera." Okay. I said this. Yeah, that's the story. Yeah.
7:10>> Yeah. Yeah. But those pictures >> that was right when Iraq was breaking out.
7:14>> Yeah. The we were heading over the Med to invade with the Marines to Turkey.
7:17This is before Turkey got shut down.
7:18Like we're going and I was going I'm a sniper. I'm [ __ ] excited. I'm invading. Like I want this. I'm going to go swim. Didn't get shoot anybody down there.
7:27>> And then when did you end up in Iraq?
7:28>> Uh my first appointment to Iraq was 2005.
7:32>> What was that like? Cuz like everyone talks about obviously the beginning >> I thought they sent me to the wrong place. I was like I've been watching this on TV. This place is the most dangerous place in the world. I I've got to be in the wrong place. I'm missing it something.
7:44>> Cuz I was in danger.
7:45>> Well, it's like we ran into bad guys. We just killed them. It's like, are they that bad or are we that good? And then and then um nine out of 10 houses were were benign. So you run into people. And that's when you start to realize, okay, not everyone here is trying to kill us.
8:00They're really not. And then that's when you start to think, if you're a thinker, like, you know what? These people have to deal with al-Qaeda all [ __ ] day.
8:07And then they got to deal with us all [ __ ] night. and they can't cross either one. I went into a house in Ramani, right? I think it might have been 07, which when it was really hot and wrong house. I'm standing in this house on a white carpet in nice neighborhood. And this woman came out with a daughter my age and I remember looking down at her white carpet that's the only ones in the house and thinking this is why they hate us. And then she offered me tea.
8:31>> Yeah.
8:31>> It's like what the [ __ ] is this? So anyway, just you start to see weird [ __ ] like that and you realize most people are not combatants. They're just trying to live, man.
8:37>> Right. And even with I mean I I talked about the invasion. A lot of migrants that actually were migrating were just trying to get away from Sharia and then the [ __ ] Sharia comes with them. Like a lot of people >> That's the thing, man.
8:47>> Because I mean living under Sharia is not [ __ ] fun. No. And you have to say you want it because they'll [ __ ] kill you.
8:52>> It's kind of a double entandra there.
8:54>> For sure. But that's the thing. It's like >> you're kind of stuck between a [ __ ] and a fart because you have to stop bad guys from doing stuff. But you have, like you said, the 90 whatever percent of people that don't want that or aren't around that, but you're in their house with the gun. And >> well, even with the uh even with the Sunnis, uh al-Qaeda is Sunnis. ISIS is Sunnis. And so they would stay in the Sunni towns like they'd come in whatever, but then they would force their way in. So you've got good guy, well, civilians and then [ __ ] al-Qaeda. And so we have to figure out now how to figure because they'll hide
9:23their guns outside. Now I got to I'm going to go in now. I got a room full of people. I got I know there's bad guys.
9:28How do I figure that out? You know what I figured out? Use the kids. How so?
9:32>> Um, that sounded bad, but talk to the kids. Find the oldest >> male who's not of fighting age. And you I mean, you've already interrogated these [ __ ] guys. You're not getting [ __ ] I mean, find him in a lie if you can, but they're going to lie to you anyway cuz you're in the [ __ ] house.
9:46So, uh, you find one of the boys and um, you ask him something easy and he answers because like I always put the interpreter behind him and then he's talking to me, blah, blah, blah. And he'll say anything and you're like, "Finally, finally the man of the house.
9:59Come here, man." And so you build him up a little bit and dust him off. It's good to talk to you, man. What what what's going on? He's like, "Well, there's these three guys here that I don't know and I don't whatever." Oh, well sh them to us. Hey, here. This is easy. Like, put them over here. It's dark as hell.
10:11Put a screen up there. Shine a light in his face. There's one. That's not one.
10:16There's two. And there's three. There's your al-Qaeda guys.
10:20>> Easy.
10:20>> Yeah. You tell him he's the man of the house. And he loves that [ __ ] >> Cuff them and go.
10:24>> And he he Yeah. Cuff these guys. Leave them. They're fine. And then he'll then he'll spread the word.
10:29How many times were you in Iraq?
10:31>> Uh, three. 05 06 07.
10:35>> 07 was the best one.
10:36>> Why do you say it was the best?
10:38>> Because we had a thing called um the awakening.
10:42And that's um was it the awakening? The Sunnis realized if we kill the Sunnis, their houses will be safe. So, they started turning them in. And then uh Stan Mcrist was in charge of Jay-E. So, he sent us on kill missions every night, like kill missions. We got to a point in the summer of ' 07 where if we only killed 11 people, we're like, "This is a waste of our time."
11:01>> That's in houses. Like, it was intense.
11:03We did a mission where uh there was a place north of Baghdad called Himbus, and it was a peninsula. So, this is 07.
11:12No one had been in there since 03 because there's like 19 um IED makers, improvised explosive roadside bombs.
11:21>> And so, there's one road, you can't drive it. they're going to blow you up.
11:24You cannot fast roll cuz it's so small.
11:26They're going to shoot you down and you can't carpet bomb them because it's so small and you don't want to kill these people that don't want to be involved.
11:31So, they came to us with this plan at Seal Team 6 and they said, "Uh, here's the problem." And so, we all looked at it and we've been beaten to death with water. We I've seen seals walk a mile out of the way to not get their feet wet. And so, we're looking at it and we're all thinking the same thing. Well, it's going to suck, but we can swim. We can swim in there and get this [ __ ] guy. So, we did 17 seals, two dogs, very important. two Malin ones went with us.
11:54So we did, it's not even a swim. It's like a swampy shitty [ __ ] rats in the grave [ __ ] But we get there and then this gunfight starts. We end up taking 10 houses. We killed all 19 dudes and it didn't hurt one of us. Didn't hurt one woman or child. And then we swam out before the sun came up.
12:10>> Those like that gets better. So the locals wake up the next day. We keep assets above them to watch because they've got uh one period >> drones.
12:21>> Yeah. So, we'll keep something up there to watch because they've got 24 hours or whatever, one cycle of sunlight to bury them. So, whoever comes to bury the bad guys, those are probably bad guys.
12:28Follow them. So, we're watching this and the locals, you can see them coming out of their houses and they're getting terrorized by these [ __ ] al-Qaeda guys. They don't like them either, but they realize all these [ __ ] dudes, these bullies are all dead. So, they have this block party and the word that we got was, yeah, they're dancing in the streets and drinking juice was the actual thing. So, this reporter from Baghdad came up to see what happened.
12:48Like, this is big news. He walked through the entire house and talked to the women that survived. And all he asked him was who came last night. And the headline in the newspaper in Baghdad said they were ninjas and they came with lions. [laughter] [ __ ] lions.
13:02>> Lions. Yeah. Big dog. Yeah.
13:05>> Jesus Christ.
13:07>> 07 was hot. Yeah. So you guys obviously like you're insanely talented and you're going in there and things feel easy for you and everything, but like when you're looking at the lay of the land by ' 07 in Iraq, were at that point, were you having any thoughts of like, damn, this is >> No, I think we're winning. We're we're killing it.
13:24>> You still thought you were winning.
13:25>> We're winning this. Yeah, we are.
13:26Because we got uh we're pushing al-Qaeda out and they're dealing with the pockets of the Shiite in in Solder City. Uh so I mean that heavy fighting in both spots, but we are doing it.
13:35Like anything else, we get uh rules and politicians involved and lawyers and you're going to lose. That's just it.
13:40They they they >> When do you think that happens?
13:42>> I remember a gunfight in Afghanistan uh shooting it out with guys in a cave and then they said, "Okay, we call for hellfires and they said, all right, we we're not saying there are women and children in the cave. We're just saying we can't prove they're not." And we're like, we've been in a gunfight with these [ __ ] guys now and you want us to retreat. Okay, we lost.
13:59>> What year is that?
13:59>> Oh [ __ ] that must have been 08.09. Oh no, 08. We were still getting Yeah. 09, man. cuz you once I mean when there's speed limits on bases I got this is actually a funny story um I went over we would go over to war zones to reinlist because you can get taxfree bonuses so we would say I got to go augment gold team so I'd go over there and you like you get in a free gunfight in Canada but you also got to reinlist get like 75 grand pretty [laughter] sweet especially when you're you're still you're still [ __ ] Navy chow like you can't afford a lot of stuff but we went over there one night we got in a really really good
14:30gunfight in Kandahar um actually this was kind of Funny because it's different on bases too because not everybody on a base not everyone that goes to Afghanistan fights >> and that's a that's a funny uh dynamic too because well we call them Fobbits.
14:44They don't get off the FOB the Ford operating base and they but they buy all the [ __ ] from the PX all the magazines all the candy. So the guys that fight don't get [ __ ] so we make fun of the Fobbits. So we're getting we're back in this um chowo tent in Kandahar and we just got a blood bath and uh we're eating and we started getting rocketed.
15:00So rockets are landing on the base and all these fobbits that are in their clean uniforms all jump under the picnic tables and there's these rangers over here that are just covered in [ __ ] and they just were fighting with us and and one dude looks down at one of the army he's army guy he's an army guy goes hey bro this place is surrounded by hesos and if one of these rockets comes through there this picnic table is not doing [ __ ] so just sit up like a man and enjoy yourselves steak so [laughter] but anyway so then I fly up to Bram I'm taking a bird back to the states Uh, another chow run. So, I'm going to go
15:31over to the chow hall by myself. I got a gun. I got on my ship and I'm going over to the chow hall to eat before I get on a C7. And this dude stops me, military police, and goes, "Hey, where's your reflective belt?"
15:43And I was in a gunfight that morning and I said, "My reflective belt?" Like, "Do you want me to get shot or you want me to hide?" Cuz I And I go, "I don't have one. Where where do I get one?" He [laughter] goes, "Well, you can get one at the PX for $3." So, I'm having fun with this kid and I go, "I can get one at the PX for $3." He goes, "Yeah." And I go, "Here I am thinking safety is free, but it's not. It's $3. It's a PX."
16:02And so he's like I And he writes me a ticket and and I wrote you a ticket. He wrote me a ticket in Afghanistan. And I said, "Okay, where do I pay this ticket?" He goes, "Well, you don't. You just get it." And I go, "So I get a free ticket for not wearing a reflective belt?" And he goes, "Yeah." And I go, "Is it a free ticket for littering?" And he's looking at me and I go, "When you call home to your mom, you lie, right?
16:25Like you don't say this is what you do in the war on terror. Like you lie.
16:29Good. And then so that's when I realized that we're losing this [ __ ] war.
16:34>> Red tape comes in like that.
16:36>> A speed limit and a reflective belt as I'm carrying a gun and camouflage.
16:40What's interesting though, I've said this a bunch before, just over the years, all the different guys that have come in, be it Delta guys, Army Rangers, Navy Seals, I've gotten some of the craziest gunfight stories ever from like >> ' 08 to 2014 Afghanistan >> and people just talking about what was what they did is a lot of those dudes, a lot of the Delta guys and the 75th Ranger Regiment is, as dumb as this sounds, they wouldn't let us fight the Taliban. We were going after highv value targets, al-Qaeda, and they just started going to Pakistan. Uh a guy by the name of Scott Moore was a captain at SEAL
17:18Team Six. He was a commanding officer and [clears throat] he he somehow finagled it that we could take the gloves off and start fighting the Taliban. And that was one of those be careful what you wish for because we're slaughtering [ __ ] in not slaughtering is bad, but we're beating the [ __ ] out of of al-Qaeda and Afghan Iraq. It's horrible. [clears throat] Then we start getting in gunfights in the mountains with Taliban. These [ __ ] have been fighting their whole lives and they are fast and they can move and they [clears throat] will fight. Um, but they're also the guys like with Marcus with Pu Wali where if you ask them for
17:46help, they'll give it to you. So that's a way different dynamic, but make sure they're posing. That's the bad day.
17:52>> Yeah.
17:53>> And those Dagistanis, they wrestle bears. We've seen that in the USA.
17:55>> Oh yeah. No, they don't [ __ ] around.
17:56>> No. Hey, respect.
17:58>> Yeah.
17:59>> Now you actually, cuz you alluded to that earlier. So you were on the team that came in and rescued lone survivor Marcus Marcus.
18:06>> I was actually in Jalalabad, Afghanistan running one of not running, sorry at an outstation. Uh and an outst you just find something and you buy it and then you hire locals like uh guys before me bought a motel and then they hired [clears throat] locals to build the fences and then they hired locals to plum be do the plumbing and then to electricity and then you hire security and that's how you win hearts and minds.
18:30I'm stimulating the economy and shield at at Jalalabad which is a huge Jbad thing and that's actually where I thought this isn't going the right direction. We're in Jalalabad Afghanistan. That was the capital for the Taliban and we're in this station.
18:45The airfield's not built yet. They that's when they announced hey we're going to surge again. This [clears throat] is the Obama administration I think. Well, right around then 0809 so whatever. Uh and I remember on the ground now we're on the ground living in Jalalabet. We're buying schwarmas and rugs and [ __ ] We know the locals. This economy is good. We're protecting the families that like, you know, this is good. You're going to surge. What? You're going to build a um you're going to build a a a wall around the airfield and then no one gets to leave the airfield? No. No. And with these new Now, instead of me driving
19:15around a motorbike, you're going to have a scared 20-year-old private driving an MRAP running over kids. You're going to go to the bazaar. You're going to let five vendors on the base to sell rugs.
19:23They're going to jack the price up 500%.
19:26They're millionaires. airport. What the [ __ ] do you think's going to happen? Why would you, sir? And you know, they did, but but uh this is before that. I went back to um I heard some guys from Seal Team 10 had just inserted snipers into one of the valleys near the Pesh. And so I went to I drove my motor bike out there and I ran into Dan Healey and and Jeff Taylor and um a bunch of guys that were there and I was just [ __ ] with him. Said, "Yeah, we inserted four snipers and they're going to find a Mod Shaw and once they give us the word, we're going to fly in." I'm like, "Fuck, that's dope. I want to get on it." I
19:54called Bram to Seal Team 6. my first deployment of SEAL team 6 and I told him I was like I want to get on this mission. They said no one from [ __ ] Seal Team 6 is getting on that helicopter because there's missiles in the valley. They're going to shoot it down. So we're I was bullshitting with Dan Healey about Sam Adams. I went through sniper school with him and we I knew he was from New England. He loves Sam Adams. And then whatever. Yeah, we'll grab one. I got another month or two here. So you're going home after this one. I'll see you. And then they took off and they I was one of the last guys to see them alive. They got shot
20:19down. So um we're back at the airfield.
20:22So Turbine 33 was shot down. Turbine 34.
20:25Uh, I don't know what happened, but these are TF-160s pilots. They landed in the wrong place when they came back after 33 was shot down, killing all 16 guys on board. So, they were So, the guys from there had to run back. I'm at Jbad. I'm watching guys uh walk in. I'm like, "Okay, okay, this world's a better place. You're you're still here. What the [ __ ] happened?" And they said, "These plumes came out and turned and they hit they missed us, hit them." And so then we have to go, "Okay, we there's a crash that we don't know if we don't know if they're survivors. So, we got to go." We get word that, well, they're not
20:54going to fly you. They're they're getting shot down, so figure it out. So, we have to um steal cars. So, I'm like, okay, there's a tent full of rangers.
21:02This is so a This is how awesome rangers are. We went in this tent. Me and another dude from six are like, "Hey, here's the situation. I I'm going to need five five guys, okay?" And they all got out of their racks, every single ranger. And they said, "Normally, it takes five minutes to get ready. We'll be outside in three." All these rangers came out like, "Go find cars, go find [ __ ] donkeys, go find water, whatever." and we had this trail and we met the guys from Abed, the CIA guys there and we drove the cars as far as we could and started walking and then we get to 10,000 ft and uh we're just up
21:30there and um we get word that Axelson and Latrella still alive trying to find Murphy and Deetsz. Uh we had some guys get up to the crash site and we went we had to call A-10s in on some dudes and it it just got weird. One of the weirdest stories up there I didn't see it but uh Lou Langas was one of the red team guys. He made it to the crash site and he sees the bodies and [ __ ] and I guess he said I'm gonna go down to that village and just like try to and he's walking away and I guess he turned around and said, "I just don't want to die like that."
21:58>> And then Lou was on Extortion 17. He died just like that on August 6, 2011.
22:03>> So just the way it all um you know [sighs] it all repeats.
22:07>> And that's that's the >> that that comes back though. That's my rule. Don't die because you got bored.
22:12>> Ask the families who were they going after that night.
22:15>> Big deal to [ __ ] time. Yeah.
22:16>> No one knows. No one cares.
22:18>> How many guys did you go up there with again?
22:20>> Uh where at >> to to go find him?
22:22>> Bin Laden.
22:22>> No, no, no, not Bin Laden. On >> they shut they shut the country down.
22:27>> They shut the country.
22:28>> Everybody went We went first with [ __ ] We had a hundred dudes >> climbing the cuz we were just climbing like everyone that thinks they can fight go up there. Like we had donkeys carrying our water. I watched donkeys jump off of cliffs. The hike was so bad.
22:42Just jump. Like that's it. The one donkey didn't pick a a cliff big or tall enough to kill him, but he picked a cliff that was tall enough to make him realize once he landed that was a bad idea. You could hear him. Yeah. And like they they finally flew some birds in.
22:56They tried to throw us water out of the bird. They threw that down a cliff. It's like and then we get up and then other guys from uh Red Squadron flew into the crash site. It's like, "Okay." But then we turn around. Then we calling A10s on these other guys. We get back down to the thing. We're awake for three day two days. And then the villager came in with a note from Marcus. So we got a note and it's like, okay, then this is the weird CIA dynamic cuz the CIA never wants to lose a source. They would rather keep a source than save an American. Swear to God, I don't want to lose my source, man. It's like,
23:23>> so this guy's here with this like we're he's walking us to this [ __ ] place.
23:27And they're trying to talk us out of it.
23:29And here's where you realize it's a weird place, too. It's like, okay, I'm going to have him show me which house Marcus is in, not realizing we're about to show this man who doesn't know what numbers are an iPad.
23:40>> [laughter] >> So, forget addition. Welcome, welcome to Apple, [ __ ] So, we might as well have shown him the face of Muhammad cuz this [laughter] [ __ ] dude. So, it's like now we're going to walk him in. They're like, "Well, he didn't cross the te's on the trail. It's like he got a social right. That's him. So, then we're going to bring this like a one of the ranger I think a major got kicked out of the country for this cuz we badmouth or we Yeah. So, we walk up um with this and we're just going to pretend he's a prisoner, but he's going to tell us. So, we go drive back in this [ __ ] hole [ __ ] V. Like if you're there by
24:09yourself, they're going to cut your head off. And we're in danger, most dangerous place in the world. Climb up the mountain. We're still been awake. And we're getting up on top. We get word he's down in this village. So, and I remember we're we're having these we're trying to talk each other like hell week trying to talk each other into going.
24:24And one of my guys said, "Okay, I I I I don't think I can go anymore." And I said, "Yeah, that's cool. We'll just tell Marcus's mom, Mrs. Latrell, that we were this close and we couldn't get him because you got [ __ ] tired." And he's like, "Yeah, you're right." And I said, "Tell me that exact same thing cuz I don't think I can [ __ ] go anymore."
24:37And then the rangers swooped in. They grabbed him. They took off and they got him. So now we're looking at this valley. We're up on a mountain. But that's me start to realize we got to get the [ __ ] out of here now.
24:49>> And then I I remember looking at my guys and I said, "This is why training is so hard. Because if you wanted to quit right now, where the [ __ ] are you going to go? You're just here now.
24:58>> So let's try to get out of here alive.
24:59That we don't want to be the next one."
25:01>> Crazy.
25:01>> Yeah. And in Afghanistan, you're I mean, you're fighting the geography as much as you're fighting any.
25:07>> It's the graveyard of empires. It's the western Himalayas that no one has gone in there and conquered it. You won't.
25:12>> It's [clears throat] just I mean, we've proven the technology doesn't matter.
25:15You got to get on the ground with the sandals and fighting with [ __ ] rocks.
25:18>> Do you want to do you have a stomach for that?
25:20>> And you you had said before right before this happened, that's when you had moved over to Dev Crew. Is that right? I moved over. Um, >> yeah, I was at I um I went I applied right after 911. I got into the 2004 selection course.
25:35>> How does that work with with >> That's a tough process. Um, you need to get approved by the conventional teams are groups of Navy Seals divided by number >> and the odd numbers are in San Diego 1357.
25:47>> Even numbers in Virginia 24810.
25:50Um, you need to get approved by them usually after 5 years uh as an active SEAL combat. Uh, and then you apply. And the way you apply is like you send in a resume. And the very basic way to get turned down is they hand your picture to the guys that are there and they just if they don't like you, you're just not, you're out. It's that simple. I've seen guys, nope. Done. So, you do that. Then they come to your team and they interview you. Then they have you do a pretty considerable test, a a PT test.
26:15So, it's a good run. It's a it's a three-mile run at a 7:30 pace, which guys fail. Uh it's like 10 pull-ups with a 45 lb weight and then your body weight 10 times bench press and [ __ ] like that.
26:27It's a legit workout. Uh and then they interview you and then uh the interview's tough because you're like like this is the start of the war. So these are no [ __ ] hard [ __ ] master chiefs. These are enlisted dudes. And then the one officer is checking your service record to make sure your ribbons all match. And then they send in the psychiatrist. That was hilarious. The first three is three weeks. The first screening process is three weeks to see if you qualify for the selection course.
26:51So the like the two and a half weeks is all get in your head. It took me a day and a half to finish a 5,000 question multiple choice test with all based on behavior. So one is never. I never feel like that. And there's two and three is like seldom and five is always. That's just it. And then the questions come up and they're in no order and they're not questions but they're all it's like the the example I give is you sit down, you're excited. Number one, you love roses. Like, [ __ ] yeah, always. That's easy. Everyone loves roses. Number two, you want to decapitate kittens. You're like, well, [ __ ] that went sideways.
27:20[laughter] And like looking at your buddy like, do we do sell them [ __ ] cats? I don't know. I So, it took me a day and a half and I asked I had the same psychiatrist for 10 years and I this is when I met her or whatever. I just got to meet her.
27:32I said, "What's the point of this test?"
27:33And she goes, "Oh, we're not trying to figure out if you're crazy. We're trying to figure out which flavor it is and then we're going to place you." And then that do that test again, that hard physical test. And at that point, if they like you, they invite you to the 9-month selection course. So, if you get you get we it was one one a year. It got to a point for two a year because we were rotating so fast. But then that process is um it's not like SEAL training where you can drown cuz guys have proven they will. So, we're trying to find people who can make decisions and stress. So, we make drills based on
28:03CQB, >> but they're long, exhausting drills with all your [ __ ] at 155 degrees Fahrenheit in Mississippi with loud music playing.
28:12All the drills in the kill house are designed for you to fail.
28:15>> You don't know that. And then they punish you for failing such an easy task. So, they beat your ass for 20 minutes. As soon as you're done getting beat, you're right back to number one, man. You're running it again. You fail again. Why are you doing that? Because they want to see how you handle it. You were going to fail that. We punished you for failing. And the test was, can you get over it? How many guys like >> 50% don't make it?
28:32>> 50%.
28:33>> Half the guys that have been Navy Seals for five years in combat don't make it through.
28:38>> It's intense. And then the ones who do become part of it.
28:40>> It's nine months.
28:41>> Nine months. And it's it's like uh it's so bizarre. Like I remember having a a day of house runs CQB so good. I am so good at this. I got it to three runs later they have me carrying a [ __ ] broom telling me I'm so unsafe. You don't belong here. You don't belong to have a gun. Run it with the broom. we'll see if we'll keep you. And then you just stay there and then you graduate. Then you go to assault team. It's like, >> and what what year did you end up doing the 9 month 04?
29:07>> Yeah. Uh and then uh then you get to the squadron where the guys are and you think you're good after seal team six selection. I [ __ ] got this. I'm fast.
29:14You get there. They're [ __ ] gone.
29:16Where? What the three five guys from select green team. Like where the [ __ ] is [ __ ] Follow them. And then you then you that's when you start to learn dudes like you're inventing tactics. You're just you're coming up with [ __ ] What?
29:28What is this? Why are we screwing this up? We come up with tactics. We're inventing [ __ ] Okay, they al-Qaeda did this that time. How How do we uh We uh they were hitting us from the 5% coming into a room because they know you got to enter. So, how we get 10 [ __ ] out of a plane to skydive at the same time? Why aren't we getting 10 [ __ ] in that room? Let's work on it.
29:47>> [ __ ] like that. And then you're just running stuff. You're dirty. Uh uh I remember talking to Dan Dirty Corbin.
29:54>> Uh fearless. Absolutely fearless. We were fearless. We were um working on what we can jump because we thought the bin lan would be a skydive a heyi ho high high opening. So we're like okay we got to figure out a painters pole because we can attach a ladder to that with a with a shepherd's hook. We might need this [ __ ] thing or whatever these law and and anything like big guns or [ __ ] If you're skydiving you're you got lines coming out if they wrap that's a horseshoe malfunction and you're probably going to [ __ ] die.
30:21>> So we're would and I had I I needed someone to do what we call the wall locker jump. everything we got. I need someone to jump it dirt. He's like, I'll do it. And I remember we had two I was one of the jump masters, another one of the jump masters. I'm the lead jumper, jump master, another jump master like tandem masters. We do this and we're just looking for his leg straps to make sure they're connected here. And I'm like, Dirty, I can't promise you anything. You You're connected and your parachute's packed well and you got a reserve.
30:50>> What's jumping at 3:00 a.m.? I'm I'm going out before you so I won't see you.
30:53I hope to see you on the ground. I hope to see you on the ground standing up cuz the nice thing about skydiving is no matter how bad it goes, you're going to [ __ ] land.
31:01>> That is right. You just might not.
31:03>> Just a matter of uh you again positive attitude. Well, even with a I explain to people the cool thing about heyo is like the way that we do it cuz you're jumping like trying to do the most basic [ __ ] because when the EMP hits, can you [ __ ] start a fire? Do you know where north is?
31:17>> Can you find true north on a flat earth?
31:19[snorts] >> Another one. That's a whole different episode. [laughter] So, I just thought I'd throw that in at you >> because it seems like True North is always in the middle.
31:28>> Not touching it. I'm not touching it.
31:29>> I'm not either. I get yelled at all the time. So, um, but as soon as you're as a lead jumper for a HeiHo stack, this is so cool because we've only we're going to a spot 11, 12, 13 miles away. We've only seen it on a map. So, you get out there just with your [ __ ] And a glide ratio is altitude, distance, speed, heading, bearing, course. Calculate that [ __ ] Can we make it?
31:46>> And then you decide for everyone, nope, can't make it. So, then as a lead jumper, if you're excited, which I am, I got to find an alternate drop zone.
31:52Let's [ __ ] do this.
31:53>> Yeah, that's not for me.
31:54>> Yeah, we uh >> that one's not for me.
31:56>> We had do like we're inventing tactics.
31:58Where do you put your night vision? Cuz we're do like cuz we had one dude's night vision cuz we were wearing them but then up.
32:03>> And this is before we put >> this is before we put the the small uh uh um this how you learn. This how you develop tactics. He jumped out. Pow. No night vision.
32:13>> And he's and we're landing on a cliff like Richard Nixon's old uh runway going up a cliff in Arizona. Like he used to land there in a shitty plane. And so we land and we had to have one of our other lead jumpers, I think Jimmy Hatch did it. He uh he had to talk him in. He's like, "You got to trust me. All right, here's your altitude. Turn left. Turn left. Turn left. Okay, one more time.
32:33Turn left. Turn left. Oh, flare. Flare.
32:34Flare. Flare. Flare." [laughter] And he lived. It's like, "Okay, from now on, uh, we're going to figure out a way to put bunggees on these. Probably jump them down and spread. And we're also carrying extra night vision."
32:43>> That's how we learn.
32:44>> Yeah. He had to do that on a cliff at night in the dark.
32:47>> And you got to figure that parachute is not just a safe. This is going 20 miles an hour forward. Imagine if you have a 15 mph wind behind you. You're landing on a cliff at 35 miles an hour and those rocks are uh not to get all technical, but those rocks are unforgiving.
33:01>> Yeah. No, you're you're breaking some bones doing that.
33:03>> Breaking your [ __ ] attitude.
33:04>> Yeah. Doing something. But how much did you feel like once you got through the nine-month training for Dev Group and then got in there and, you know, started working up with those guys, how much did you feel like your approach shift where it's like, whoa, this is this is different than what I used to even though I was already a SEAL. I already saw a lot of combat. I was already doing my thing. Like this these guy this just operates differently. I'm thinking differently now.
33:27>> Uh just the assets um the mindset was way different. The there was no doubt about whether or not we can do it. It's how right >> how are we going to figure this out? And then and then it's it's the whole um if there's an issue like right now problem solving and and someone sees the way you move to solve it, they're just going to come help you with it. Like I oh I got to I have input for this like really sharp dudes and and with that comes a sense of humor too. I think the smarter the people the funnier they are. That was one of the thing I was never worried about um about the physical stuff for
33:55getting in because of the tactics. When I checked into Seal Team 2 the first time, one of the first guys I met was Don Shipley and he's a pretty famous SEAL. That's a funny [ __ ] He came in. You must be the new guys. Yeah.
34:04[ __ ] senior chief. Cool. You want to go to the Chiefs Club, get a beer? Yes, I do. And then hearing guys banter was like, "Oh [ __ ] these dudes are good."
34:11And then you get to see Team Six. I thought it was pretty [ __ ] funny. Uh, and I and I'm flying the wall there listening. I'm like, "I got to step my game up again. These guys are fine."
34:18>> But then with that comes from morale.
34:20And with the morale, it's the guy down Bin Laden's hallway. I know that [ __ ] dude.
34:25>> Like that's that that's what that's the whole It's It's cool to say never leave a man behind, but [ __ ] I know his kids, man.
34:30>> Yeah.
34:30>> Like that [ __ ] So, and uh his favorite shitty [ __ ] joke. I know what Barry drinks right before he dies. Like, I know these guys. So, it's a it's a it's a that that's why I love the human element of everything because there's a human element with both sides. Both sides cuz figure this, >> nobody thinks they're the bad guy >> like puts themselves in his shoes.
34:46>> Al-Qaeda, they're righteous. They're freedom fighters.
34:49>> No one thinks they're the like I'm like even serial killers or psychopaths. So, they think they're doing something their own enjoyment is uh is the right thing.
34:56No one's out there.
34:59>> Yeah. So, >> do you ever like do you ever wonder if some of the bad guys that not necessarily al-Qaeda, but some of the bad guys you may have been sent in to go get, there was a reason they were that way.
35:15>> Meaning like >> why they're fighting us.
35:17>> Yeah.
35:17>> Oh, yeah. They're fighting us because we're there.
35:19>> Uh, Iraq really kicked off because it's so much easier to go fight Americans in Iraq than in the mountains.
35:25>> So, they started showing up from everywhere. like uh uh Abu Musab Alazari was from Jordan and he cut off Nick Burke's head personally.
35:31>> Like he was a dude that Bin Laden actually started emailing like, "Hey homie, you need to pipe it down a little."
35:35>> He was the godfather of ISIS.
35:37>> Oh yeah. Yeah.
35:38>> Mhm.
35:39>> So uh um yeah, a lot of dudes are fighting just because we're there. Um nothing else to do. Seriously, Afghanistan, that's just what they do.
35:46And then uh I mean you got to figure too if you're going to if you're going to be an honest person, it doesn't matter your intentions. You spend enough time in someone else's house, you're you're an occupier, >> right? And they I mean there's I mean even when I was saying like that I see why they don't like us. Yeah. I mean you're running over my kids with your [ __ ] foreign vehicles. I'm pissed at you. I'm going to fight you. I'm going to fight you. Come here. I'm fighting.
36:05That's that's what they they there's national pride everywhere.
36:08>> What was it like for you to see 20 years after Afghanistan not just fall the way it did but effectively that >> uh typical politics >> uh typical promise campaign promise. I will end the war in Afghanistan. And then doesn't matter how as long as I promise it and I do. That's just pol politicians >> don't say anything about victory.
36:28>> Oh [ __ ] We forgot to win a long time.
36:29We don't even teach winning anymore. We don't teach it in themies that our officers don't know how to win. There's no >> How do you figure that?
36:36>> They just there's no competition to win.
36:38What is winning? I think Patton knew how to win and then Oh, of course he said, you know, we should have been fighting the Russians >> and then he died. He He died getting a tooth pulled.
36:46>> They didn't like that.
36:46>> Big Deep State doesn't like that. They got Central Banks to run that.
36:49>> Yeah, they they didn't like that. But you don't think they teach winning at West Point or any of these places? No, they're still teaching which bathroom to use. Oh, themies are bad. Yeah.
36:59>> How does that get?
37:00>> I mean, they've got their guys. They they have their studs. Like you you don't get into the academy either, any of them without being a stud academically, physically, all that stuff. Men and women. Um, >> but you don't think they can be winners?
37:12>> Well, oh, they can, but the problem is the hierarchy because, uh, at some point again, uh, power people need to get promoted. In order to get promoted, I got to do the [ __ ] that the commander's intent says we need to have command climate. Oh, someone someone's worried about their ass getting stared out. So, we better talk about sexual harassment. And then it gets into worse and worse and worse. And did you did like I mean even like did you get your cavity filled because you can't go to Afghanistan. What? What? What the [ __ ] >> Right. Red tape everywhere.
37:34>> Red tape everywhere. Rules of engagement. Rules. Rules. Rules. Yeah.
37:37>> But a guy like Admiral McGraven was clearly like a winner.
37:40>> Well, I mean, you know, he's got his critics, but he was just the [ __ ] man.
37:43>> Yeah.
37:44>> And he Well, Admiral Mcraven looks like a [ __ ] seal. Like he's he looks and sounds like a Navy Seal. That's what I want to look and sound like. And that like when I get fired about the stories like imagine how afraid al-Qaeda must have been. They couldn't hear us but we got 23 [ __ ] Bill McRavens running through the house coming to get you.
37:59>> Good luck.
37:59>> Yeah, you're going to lose.
38:01>> That's a tough day.
38:03>> You know it's like talking with you like your like I was saying earlier your almost gified approach to everything like oh this is the next thing I can go get this. This is exciting and all that.
38:12It all started though with you going in and being recruited by the wrong place.
38:16>> Seriously. And yet, you know, >> well, that's that's the people need to realize that in life. When I talk to someone who says, I like the one that pisses off veterans is, well, I was going to join, but I didn't. Blah, blah, blah. And they get pissed. I don't get pissed at that. They the guy will say, "Well, I I tried SEALs, but I I quit."
38:31Blah, blah. I'm like, "Well, that worked out really well for you then." Why?
38:34Well, do you have kids? Yeah. Well, you wouldn't have them if you made it. So, that's a you're here today with them, so it's a good day. like well I'll say to so my I have college age kids and they'll say uh something about a term paper we're studying for finals today is a shitty day I'm hung over blah blah blah I'm like oh yeah hey here's something to think about talking to my daughters if a 23-year-old dude in the Marine Corps wasn't stationed in but Montana as a recruiter in um 1995 and he wasn't at Arby's at 11:30 on a Wednesday you wouldn't be alive >> how was that turnp doesn't [ __ ] matter
39:09>> the butterfly effect yeah 100% Like that's the drinking thing. This tattoo on 71 1925 probably look really stupid, but on 71835 that's pretty badass.
39:19>> Yeah, >> that's the butterfly. But you want to make a change in life. You're 2% now in 10 years going to be pretty [ __ ] dope.
39:25>> Had you thought about though at all before you walked in that office the idea of like taking a life of anyone?
39:32>> No, because there's not going to be a war. It's over.
39:36>> The closest we came was uh Blackhawk Down 93.
39:39>> So you thought you were just going to base live it? I thought chicks would dig it. Yeah. Literally. I got dumped by a chick. I'm going to be a Marine. Chicks.
39:45Now, >> when did that change?
39:46>> Well, I joined the Navy, so now I got to be gay. [laughter] >> No, it was uh that's my entire career was um uh Okay, it is the Navy. I I just signed to be a SEAL. I'm not going to make it. Um but I get to go to Coronado.
40:04I get to live on barracks on that beach.
40:06This is before we started getting all the tea. I want to [ __ ] in the water.
40:09So, it's going to be awesome. I'm going to get assigned to a ship after they kick me out because I'm not quitting.
40:13And then I'll have four years worth of sea stories. I'll go sea stories. I go back to but Montana and I'll sit at Maloney's pub and I'll drink beer and I'll tell Sea Stories. That's it. I I get to SEAL training and I remember it being so hard. I don't have I do have a past. I don't have a future. I'm just going to be in hell. And then on Monday like, "Hey, go to medical, get your record and your service record cuz you're getting assigned to SEAL team, too." It's like, "What the [ __ ] does that mean? You made it through." No.
40:36SEAL training doesn't. Yes, it does. So you drive out there Fort Benning, Georgia, work with the army, learn how to jump, get to SEAL team 2, finish this [ __ ] This flight deployment four years up, done, single. I do not want to go back to But Montana. I love these guys.
40:48I will reinlist. So I reinlist. I meet guys like Jaco. Uh [ __ ] >> You're also in the special forces. Like you don't need a war. You there's missions you have where you got to go places.
40:58>> What I miss about that is the skydiving trips to Tucson. You're going to live in a Marriott on the [ __ ] campus of the University of Arizona. You're going to skydive all day and then your buddy Nelson Miller owns the [ __ ] Trident on Speedway. I'm going to go there all night and then I'm going to do that every day. I miss that [ __ ] But I mean, even the thing with the reinlistment, I reinlisted just to stay with the guys at 911. I can't leave reinlist. I went to Seal Team Six on a [ __ ] whim. I was going to get out of that. Uh I was close >> cuz I'd fought a little bit, not enough.
41:26I went to a a leadership course on Oceanana annex damn neck where Seal Team 6 is. Uh went to a course in my uniform.
41:34Went to lunch at the Navy Exchange because you know everyday low prices Navy Exchange your family store. Uh and there's a [laughter] gota gota plug Navy Exchange. I go in there's a dude in flip-flops, cut off cammy pants and like a beard and he sees my trident and he's I [ __ ] me and I'm like that's a Seal Team Six guy. [ __ ] him. I'm going to find out what that's all about.
41:55>> So I went Seal Team Six because of him basically. I I was on the fence whether or not I'm going to try out and I did.
41:59But again, you had seen you had seen combat over >> a little bit. Not as not as much.
42:03>> Not a ton, but a little bit enough to know bullets [ __ ] >> Yeah. But it's still like I want to see my family again. So I might get out. But then I saw the six. I'm like, okay, I'm definitely going there now.
42:12>> But there had That's what I'm saying.
42:14Like it's an interesting way you put it.
42:15You have a past, but you don't have a future when you're in buds. But then you get out, they're like, go to [ __ ] Seal TV.
42:19>> What does that mean? I'm No, I'm I'm you. I I make my bed every morning. I brush my teeth. I get to the workout on time. That's what I do. What do you mean? I got to What the [ __ ] is a seal?
42:28You've been teaching me nothing. I've been beaten.
42:30>> But now you have to think about both sides of the equation at some point there, right? Where it's like anywhere I could go, I could die. And anywhere I go, I may have to take a life.
42:36>> Well, I mean, we got guys that went to Arizona for one of them skydive trips, never came back.
42:40>> Even that. But like thinking about the stuff that's higher percentage possibility, like did you ever like slow down for a second and be like, "Wow."
42:47>> Um, combat is a lot like the mindset of combat is a lot like skydiving. It's a lot like shark diving. I like to dive without cages with apex predators.
42:57>> Oh, that's nice. the the uh it's great stress relief. It's um the scary part is from the bench to the door. So, right before I skydive, that's the part you're like, "All right, all right." And then you jump. It's over. It's on. When you get in the water with the tiger sharks or the great whites, it's just on. And when you get to combat, it's just on. Uh and then when you get to combat though, you realize, I'm actually really good at this and they're not and I can see at night and they can't. I like this. I'm good at this. My friends are here. Like one of the rules is if if you have to go somewhere, bring a gun and bring a
43:27friend with a gun. You're going to Yeah, it's the whole I came up with when I was using an M4, which is right before we started using the 416s from HK. I had a thing with I stopped carrying an escape and evasion kit like which is your extra whatever um blah blah blah [ __ ] signal device, right? I stopped carrying it because that's a waste of my weight.
43:44I have the M4 charge card and they would say, "What is an M4 charge card?" It's like it's a it's simple. You have a car, I have a gun. I now have a car and a gun. [laughter] You can charge anything with this thing.
43:54>> So, yeah, just [ __ ] like that. You adapt. Yeah. And then you find yourself in situations like the one in Pakistan where it's like [ __ ] five guys on however many are in the high are in the high ground like that >> in just joking your way through it and then suddenly you get your oh [ __ ] moments where like this is I mean don't get me wrong I did take everything very serious and if I could if I could have a mission go perfectly it wouldn't be as funny. So I would be serious. But when [ __ ] goes side, it's like I think someone even asked on on the mission like did you do what happened? The helicopter crash. You
44:27do that [ __ ] on purpose? No, [ __ ] idiot.
44:30>> He's [ __ ] with you know. So the sense of humor is there. But if it's >> if a mission is going perfect, there's your problem though. So now I got to be really serious cuz that's the pro. I'm walking into an ambush cuz you do need to realize in combat anything you do can get you killed including nothing. Like there were dudes that died like survive combat and then are leaving a [ __ ] on base and get hit with a rocket and then your time's up.
44:50>> Yep. And and again too, that's uh there's a reality of my adminship better be in order. Do I have my will the correct way? Because guys were [ __ ] with that. Guys were like, uh there was a dude said, "Yeah, I want this guy singing Tiny Dancer a uh a capella, not a capulco at my funeral." Like I want him singing, but then guys start dying.
45:07It's like, "All right, strike that. Um I need to get more life insurance cuz [ __ ] that he didn't come home. His kids are okay." And then you, you know, you get all your [ __ ] squared away. And it's like it is a just make sure your shit's in order cuz uh the the wor the worst conversation I hated was uh did you know? It's like did you know Scott Neil?
45:25It's like what the [ __ ] do you mean did I know?
45:28>> Did you know Mike Ko? Yeah. What happened?
45:32>> Yeah. Getting the uh I uh I was actually after the binlan raid in I was I was the liazison for JC in Fort Bragg. So after the bin Lad was down there in August and I was we were we went out one night and I went back to the hotel and I'm getting ready to go to bed. They said a um helicopter was just shot down in Afghanistan. A lot of people on board like oh [ __ ] man. I So I drive in a JC and I just type [clears throat] a a message um what just happened to my guys over in Afghanistan. I got a response immediately with a list of names. 31.
46:01>> Yeah. 31 names.
46:02>> 31.
46:03>> 31.
46:05>> I knew 17 of them.
46:08>> And so you get uh you process something like that.
46:10>> You don't that's you don't that we finished line. on a high and now we lose all and we lose the best [ __ ] guys.
46:16>> 17.
46:17>> Yeah. Uh >> that you knew.
46:19>> Yeah. Robert James Reeves was on there.
46:21Robert I'm Robert James O'Neal. He's Robert James Reeves. I just named my first son after him. I named him Reeves.
46:26So he's a Robert He's Reeves Thomas, but I named after Robert James because >> he I had one of the most profound moments with him. I went through selection with Rob Reeves. And I wasn't his roommate. Wasn't his best friend.
46:36But always every time I spent time with Rob Reeves, it was just quality time. He was never rattled. whenever I'd get rattled and have a [ __ ] idea like and he would say he would be the guy say you know what that's probably a bad idea just like that call him that and gunfights I I've been in fights with him before and it's like just the really good-looking [ __ ] >> cool and I went to his house after the bin Laden raid and he was gold team I was red team >> and uh uh he he just he was good because I don't know how to handle that [ __ ] you just killed Bin Laden no one knows how to handle that and then you got the
47:06[ __ ] whatever and so I don't know what we're going to do with this so I went to his house and he poured a glass of red wine I was a big drinker at the time and he said, "You want a glass of red wine?" I said, "I'm good tonight. I think I'm good." He said, "Okay." And he sat there with me and he he took a sip of his red wine. He said, "You know, one of these days a lot of us are going to die on one of those helicopters."
47:24Yeah.
47:26Just like that. And then what, a month later, he died on one of those helicopters.
47:29>> Oh my god.
47:30>> Because we're just packing it in. We all knew that [ __ ] One, you only you only need to be right or wrong once. A bullet needs to be right once.
47:36>> One RPG kills everybody. That's it. And he was on it.
47:39>> That's the thing. I think about that with all you guys.
47:41>> Oh yeah, man. We don't lose all these times. You were there. We don't lose a Yeah. Great.
47:45>> It's like all you need was one that went this way instead of that way.
47:48>> We were on an insertion one time. And again, I I mentioned the pilot's calm voice. Like when you're flying somewhere and you hit an air pocket and spill something on yourself and the pilot comes over and says, "Well, obviously we get some weather up here at 38,000 ft."
47:59Is it calm you the [ __ ] down >> cuz you're not helping him and he's got this [ __ ] right? He's a pilot. He's a [ __ ] man. But uh we were inserting on a 47. It's always a 47. And Al Mack was flying. I'll never forget Al Mack, probably the greatest pilot in the history of the army. And that says a lot because if you're the best pilot in the history of the army, you're the best pilot ever. And like I have a shirt that we made that says I know Al Mac. Like he's the man. He saved everyone's life when Neil Roberts fell out on on Robert's Ridge Takar cuz he got hit and then he he you got to talk to that guy.
48:30But, uh, he was flying us in.
48:31>> Cool.
48:32>> On a 47. And it's again the with the the twin thing. Bigger than a school bus.
48:35Like this thing gets hit, everyone dies.
48:37And you never do a hot insert. That's Hollywood [ __ ] If you're doing a hot insert, you [ __ ] up. And we didn't know these people. And so we're inserting on a 47. I was a team leader on the ramp and one of my other team leaders up front. We're looking at the starboard side and uh the right side.
48:51It's always the right side. And these flaming football started shooting RPGs.
48:56Zip zip. And we're on like final. So, we're flaring and you're you're just you this is it. And then we hear I look at the team leader. We're on uh uh the communication system for the bird and we hear it's a dish. I look at him and I can hear him speaking. I see his mouth. He goes, "Is that a [ __ ] dishka?" And they're designed to shoot and we're like, and so there's a realization this is this could be and Al Mack knowing that he's flying the [ __ ] thing. He's fly lead. He came over to calm us down.
49:22All he said was, "Well, this is [ __ ] bullshit." [laughter] >> And that works. guys.
49:29>> And then he he he landed and we all got up. We killed every one of those [ __ ] He took off.
49:32>> Yeah. That's why he's him.
49:34>> He needed to say that to us. I need you so I can snap out of it. Isn't that >> comedy again?
49:39>> And he was right. This is [ __ ] [ __ ] >> Yeah. Did anything change for you when you had kids like perspective wise on the missions you >> Yeah. Um cuz I had uh my kids dur before and during selection and then one I had >> Shield Team Six.
49:55>> Shield Team S. Yeah. And um yeah, the because they got the goodbyes. I was when when we on my birthday, Good Friday, April 10th, I was in my daughter's Easter tea party at her preschool. And I was actually bringing her a pink plate with cookies and [ __ ] that four-year-olds eat. And I got a message for Cap Phillips and I had to look down on her and give her a kiss and go to war from a preschool classroom on a long weekend. And like that's hard. And like that and and I the hardest goodbye was when we were seven. That was a one-way mission. We're going to die on this. And so saying goodbye to them, I said she
50:27was always there when I um I said goodbye to her on all of those, but my youngest daughter at the time was three and she came. This is for Bin Laden. I couldn't even tell him I was leaving.
50:37>> How long before the mission is this?
50:40>> Oh, this is as I'm leaving >> like But how many?
50:42>> No, sorry. The the one goodbye was for Well, when I kissed her goodbye for Captain Phillips, 15 hours and 46 minutes later.
50:48>> Yeah, that one was right away for uh I'm leaving for the Bin Laden raid right now.
50:51>> So, this is like 4 days before week.
50:54>> Okay. And then my daughter, my three-year-old, got her Hello Kitty carry-on and put Mr. Elephant and a pillow in it because that's all she could understand. And she said something about taking her on vacation when I come home or some [ __ ] Like crazy [ __ ] And then I got to leave. Yeah, it's tough one. That's why the 90-minute flight back on the helicopter is like, I might get to see him again. This is big.
51:13That's tough. [snorts] They're tough kids, man.
51:15>> I'm saying though, but like I can't even imagine.
51:20>> They don't know. But you know, cuz at the time you're thinking >> all your buddies know, too. They they did the same [ __ ] like these we all have families. We're you know cuz we're 30 33 year old dudes.
51:29>> How do you walk away from that?
51:30>> Um that's a good question. I know that I can cry for 5 minutes in my car, but then I'll get there so I can stop. Like well can you how can you compartmentalize whatever pain you're about to go and then and then you then you got to turn it the [ __ ] on and this is this could be it. They're going to be proud of me. I wrote a letter when my one of my daughters was seven. I didn't write it to the seven-year-old. I wrote it to the 27-year-old and I just saying I'm really sorry I missed your wedding.
51:51I know you're beautiful and I want to thank you for taking care of your sisters and your mom and and here's what we did and it was noble and why and tears hitting the page like I [ __ ] man I I'm explaining to her in 20 years why I'm not there and uh then the hard so I had three daughters at the time I had to write them all letters then I have to find someone to give them to them because everyone with me is going to be dead so I got to find someone who's not going to be dead but that means he doesn't know what the mission is so I had I had to like layer this in a manila envelope and find an intel guy. I found
52:21a Navy intel guy. I said, "Hey, uh, here's who I am. And here's this and you're going to need to in 24 hours there's instructions inside. So, open this and then do what you do and then just give it back to me when you see me next. If not goes, how will I know?" And I go, "I assure you, you're going to [ __ ] know. Just hold on to this for a while." Then I came back and I grabbed them. I immediately shredded him, which is probably a mistake.
52:45>> You can't write that in a movie.
52:47>> No, >> you couldn't. That's >> I should have helped with the movie. It was It was pretty good. That's just like like that puts goosebumps on me.
52:54>> It's real. I mean, it's the uh that you think about that [ __ ] and then when you see other kids on target now, you think, well, that's someone's kid. Someone really cares about them. And it's again, what are the what are we what are all these men doing here killing each other right now? And who's who sent us all here >> for why?
53:07>> Do you think humanity can exist without war?
53:09>> No, >> you don't.
53:11>> Humanity can't humanity could exist peacefully as if it weren't for humanity.
53:20I agree. But please explain that >> we just [ __ ] everything up. We We The third person to be created by God killed the fourth.
53:28>> Like it just that's just how we do.
53:32>> It's like societies change, technology changes, relationships and how people interact across cultures. That changes in some ways too. But the human nature coefficient never changes.
53:45>> Never.
53:46>> It just operates in different ways. But I I unfortunately agree with you. I what I'd like to see though, I'm an optimist.
53:52>> I am too.
53:53>> You know, what I'd like to see is a world that minimizes it where you do have like some nations around the world where there is legitimately like that phrase like peace through strength, but it's a constant deterrent and then people don't do things. But >> well, I mean, you can find it and the best way to do that is to take this thing in your pocket and leave it at home and then go outside in the grass, take your shoes off. Like I got a thing with this is a cool one too with my my youngest daughter Valor.
54:19>> Uh she's a two-year-old and I will her name is Valor. That's kind of sad.
54:22>> Yeah. In Valor there is hope.
54:24>> I like that.
54:25>> Yeah. She's good. She's my little buddy.
54:27And we will what I like to do with her is we'll play the little game is let's go act like puppies. And I said that at first because I didn't realize how cool it actually was. But if you act more like a puppy, your life's better. All that means is we're going to take our shoes off. We're going to go out in the lawn and we're going to lay in the grass and look up. and she gets to see the sky and the trees and doesn't get that angle. So I don't have a phone, there's no music playing, I hear the birds, I hear her laughing and I'm getting the energy from the earth that all of a sudden there we could be doing better
54:52and everyone can do that because again all the problems on the phone are not all real. Yeah, there's [ __ ] Yeah, I get pissed, but there is some good out there. It's just we need to put a check on the humanity >> 100%.
55:05>> And then also the uh the people in power, you got to realize like they're telling you [ __ ] so they stay in power, not for your good. They don't care about your good. They don't care about the bluecollar worker. They don't care about raising your taxes. They care about staying in power. It's addicting. I've seen it in DC. You walk outside. It's [ __ ] addicting.
55:22>> How long did you stay there?
55:23>> Uh, probably two years and I moved to Texas. Then I met Jessica and then I moved to New York.
55:28>> So, this was after your first marriage and after obviously after you. What years was this when you were in DC?
55:33>> I got out in 2012. So, >> yeah. But what year were you in DC?
55:36>> Uh, I was in DC from 12 to 14. Oh, right away.
55:40>> Yeah, I moved right up. Like I left my house, moved my kids somewhere else, and I drove up to DC to start work.
55:44>> And then two years later, >> but I didn't know what I was gonna do.
55:47Yeah, I didn't know what I was gonna do.
55:49>> And then I uh [clears throat] Yeah, I moved to Texas and then I met Jess in Florida. Then we went to New York.
55:54>> Real quick, I got to go to the bathroom.
55:56I want to pick >> stand up, too.
55:57>> All right. So, while we were away, we're back now. We pulled up this picture you were talking about earlier.
56:02>> Yeah, that's Monrovia, Liberia, where we had to swim in because there was a civil war. And a little trivia there, too. Um, Monrovia. So, Liberia is a country that was actually given to freed slaves because Liberia means liberty, >> right?
56:15>> Monro Monroe was the president. It's capital.
56:18>> And they're American flag. It's a It's a red, white, and blue. There's one star and they're actually very appreciative of Americans.
56:25>> That's cool. I didn't know that history.
56:26>> Yeah. They speak English over there.
56:27Yeah. And like they're Okay. Because you're involving people. So, it turns into [ __ ] debauchery. But, uh, really like very proud of their country and [ __ ] like that. just they, you know, get [ __ ] in charge, don't have money, and all of a sudden they start eating each other. So, what are you going to do? [laughter] >> Were they happy to see you come up on the beach?
56:44>> One day, one day you're just jumping bus fairs and next you're eating each other.
56:46>> Yeah. Well, you know what? That's human nature.
56:48>> No, but when we came in, you can see them celebrating all the people that fired up cuz they thought we were there to rescue them.
56:53>> You look so different there.
56:55>> Yeah, I was pretty big and I was young.
56:57>> Yeah. Look at the fat dip.
56:58>> 26. Big fat dip in.
56:59>> Big fat dip in your [ __ ] chin right there. Yeah, we were um I this is after my platoon with Jaco and Jaco cuz I was a pretty good uh cardio guy and Jaco said, "That's cute, but if I get shot with all my [ __ ] on, can you carry me home?" I was like, "No." He goes, "You need to get in the gym." And he would do stuff like here's here's what we're going to do. Everyone is >> uh everyone needs to bench press over 300 lb and then we're going to eat together and when you're done eating, we're going to eat a little more >> and that was just it. So, but yeah, >> I can get with that.
57:26>> Yeah, cool. I like that. on a Navy ship if you if you have the right uh chefs, they can cook a lot of burgers. [ __ ] yeah. So, you just eat straight beef.
57:33Yeah. Uh but yeah, we got big. We were bench pressing big and then we just swam in there and then looked around.
57:37>> You're looking jacked. Like that's the right kind of big. You know what I mean?
57:40>> Yeah. Swimming in the uh Atlantic through crocodiles will do that.
57:45>> There was no crocodiles just to be clear because I will get called that on social media. You're in Liberia, there's no crocodiles. Like, well, there could be.
57:50>> Well, they told you there.
57:51>> Yeah. I mean, the thought of it. You get in a pool, you don't think there's a shark, but you >> as soon as you're in the water, you do.
57:57>> So, >> all right. Well, going back to the end of your career and the consummation of it, if you will, when you had obviously the one of the greatest special opsions of all time that we've been talking about all day with the Bin Laden thing, the first of all, what was the decision-m process like? What or the legality of like you eventually becoming public with being one of the guys because not everyone on the team is public.
58:18>> No. um that that's an internal dynamic that started the second Bin Laden was dead because the first question everyone asked was who got him >> including in the house. That was actually kind of funny because I I overheard a conversation who got him and he said Nisro and the guy goes [ __ ] we're never going to hear the end of this. [laughter] So, uh, that started and then, uh, you know, even you get back, we got back to Jbad, then we flipped to Bogam with the body. Soon as they, the army took the body to dump Sea like they said they did. We went to find the CBS. They have they said they did. I didn't say it like
58:50that. I didn't see him get dumped.
58:51>> They told me they told me just like they told you. I don't know. I didn't see it happen. If I didn't see it happen, maybe >> you did see the body though, right?
58:57>> I killed Osama bin Laden. I saw him standing. I saw him dead. That [ __ ] dead.
59:01>> Okay.
59:01>> Uh, that's good.
59:02>> Well, the way I put it, too, is I shot the guy who got out of bed with Mrs. bin Laden. So, he had it coming.
59:08>> He's getting killed that day. Um, you know, if it ain't been bin Laden, but Bin Laden come home, he's going to be pretty pissed off. [laughter] Um, but yeah, then we went over to the CBS because the construction battalion, Navy CBS, they they will have a pizza oven cuz they're builders. They will have booze cuz they're Navy. So, we went there. They have internet. And then we started to see the Seal Team Six coming up on Yahoo and all that [ __ ] And guys were making phone calls and they'll call their buddies in San Diego and they'll talk to a bartender where it's like, "Hey, don't tell anybody but and
59:34then my name's just out." So, it was out by the time we got back to Virginia. We flew back that night and it's just out.
59:41We had a big party at Seal Team 6. We went out to the Ready Room, which is where they filmed the scene in Navy Seals where Charlie Sheen like beat up that dude and kissed him. Same bar. How fitting is that?
59:50>> That's kind of cool.
59:51>> He would have been admiral by now.
59:52Admiral Hawkins. Charlie Sheen. I called him too. [laughter] >> Not after. I It took me a few years to meet, >> but he gave me the script.
59:58>> Uh, and I have a signed picture of him and I think he signed Admiral Hawkins on it.
60:02>> Oh, that's actually >> Did he put winning there, too? Uh, you know what? I'm going to send it back to him. He'll do it.
60:06>> Yeah.
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