0:01It's like Turkey, I had been talking about that, but I hadn't been there as well. So now I have got those under my belt and we certainly made some incredible discoveries. We got to see some private off off-limits sites that were remarkable and uh all of the research and a lot of the things that I've talked about that we built up has really come to a different place now. It's quite exciting.
0:24>> What what makes it in a different place now?
0:27>> Well, when you go to these locations, actually get a chance to investigate them, see them, you see a lot of things that you've never seen before.
0:36When you're you know, you're looking online, you only have so much in front of you, you know, who's taking pictures of this, who's taking video of this, but what about the things that didn't get photographed or you didn't see? Things that you're there in person, even just being there gives you a different experience of those locations. Um and for me, being there with a team of of experts, you know, I I just got back from from Turkey on my second trip or in uh early October with Dr. Robert Schoch.
1:04>> Oh, you went with him?
1:05>> Famous geologist and we went with an archaeologist named Hans Orberg out of Sweden. Um we got a chance to go and scout out some of the locations that they need to see as well before we do filming this year that we're going to be going and doing a whole a whole team whole team of experts is going to be going with me to film a lot of sites including underwater under Lake Van.
1:29>> Who's doing the underwater shots?
1:30>> Well, we have a team of underwater divers that are going to be coming and one of the things I can bring up is that the person who discovered the underwater ruins in 2017, and that's a that's a great story I can tell.
1:42>> Please.
1:43>> Um okay, well, his name is Tahsin Ceylan and he is uh pretty famous underwater photographer and videographer.
1:50>> And tell people where just for people who haven't heard you in the past on this show, you've talked about Lake Van, but just give them a layout of like where this is in Turkey and what the significance is.
1:58A lot of the ancient world has these hotspots that people talk about, right?
2:03Everyone's talking about Göbeklitepe.
2:05Göbeklitepe over and over again, right?
2:06Karahan Tepe, but they're they're not talking about a lot of these newer places cuz they haven't hit the mainstream. It's not something that most people really know about, and the reason is that they're too new. For instance, the the underwater Lake Van discoveries that I'm referring to, that wasn't found until 2017.
2:26>> Mhm.
2:27>> And so we're talking about very, very new discoveries that the world has not grasped yet. And the reason is that archaeologists have mislabeled them from, in my opinion, from the wrong time period, which has created a scenario where people are like, "Oh, well, that's not that interesting. It's, you know, it's from this time period." When really what we're looking at are places that are equally, if not older than Göbeklitepe, in my opinion.
2:51>> What are the archaeologists labeling on a on a time period scale, Lake Van, and what do you think it actually is?
2:58>> So the Lake Van region was part of what's called the Urartian civilization in that archaeologists are crediting for it. Now, I obviously agree that was a major civilization in that region. That was around 2,800 BC. Okay, so about 3,000 years ago. There was a civilization there that was during the same time as the Neo-Assyrian civilizations further south in ancient Mesopotamia, right? Ashurbanipal, Sennacherib. We've talked about them before.
3:26There was a competition going on over empires fighting during that time period, and they were being invaded constantly, and they were a war civilization. Now, that is that group, the Urartians, is what archaeologists believe built all of these sites around, not only Lake Van, but further east in Armenia and other locations. And we can talk about why they believe that and what we know we're getting into, but the what really broke this open is that getting back to what I was just referring to, Lake Van in Eastern Turkey, there's a it's one of the By the way, it's one of the largest and deepest lakes on Earth. It is it's over 1,500 ft
4:06deep. That's crazy lake. I mean, Baikal in Siberia is the deepest, but this on a scale of others it's it's unbelievable.
4:14I mean, it's deeper than most of the Great Lakes. It's very, very deep lake.
4:18Um and it has a very unique environment.
4:21It's what's known as a soda lake, an alkaline lake.
4:24And this actually can tie into a lot of the exciting news that we're going to get into is because it's a soda lake, it creates an environment that preserves things underwater.
4:34And it has these massive type of structures from the the salt formations that have created these incredible almost like dream-like environments of these towers underwater.
4:45>> What's the science there? Why does that preserve it? My head would immediately think that it would do the opposite, but what why why does why does it not?
4:52>> If you get if you get a lake that has river outlets, you get a current flowing through it. You're going to get moving water, you're going to get moving sediments. You're going to get a an environment underwater that is more volatile, okay?
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5:42>> When you have an alkaline environment, it doesn't create it doesn't create a scenario where there is much as much acidification to like breaking down of materials underwater. It's actually creates a preservation type of quality.
5:55And that is what we're finding in Lake Van. It's probably is the it's the best example in the world of a soda alkaline lake. There's no better example than that. And because of that, it's created this preservation underwater. Again, as I say these giant towers of basically alkaline like calcified environments that have formed because of the amount of sodium. There's only one fish that lives in the entire lake. It's called a pearl mullet.
6:21>> They only have one fish?
6:22>> Only one fish lives in the entire lake.
6:24There's nothing else. There's no other life. There is there's in there's some small little shrimp-like creatures and some types of insects, but there's no other fish that live in the entire lake.
6:35It's a very unusual type of scenario.
6:38And that's what leads to what I'm about to tell you is that this wasn't even an archaeologist. There was a there's a famous videographer, underwater photographer, Tahsin Ceylan, who travels all over the world. Yeah, t a h s i n Tahsin Ceylan s e y l a n >> In Lake Van?
7:00>> And he well, he primarily does underwater ocean photography in the Red Sea and off of Egypt and other places around the world. He's actually quite popular and he's been in a number of different high-level type of docu- documentaries and others. Well, he came to Turkey well, he lives in Turkey, but he came to Lake Van because he wanted to photograph the underwater um microinvertebrate type of environments underwater and the and the life. It's a beautiful lake. I mean, Lake Van is surrounded by the Taurus Mountains to the south and this huge mountain volcano to the north called Suphan Mountain
7:38that's over 13,000 ft high. Huge volcano. And because it's surrounded by giant mountains and it's this huge kind of crystalline lake it's beautiful.
7:47It's got like blue water because of the salt.
7:50The lake literally looks blue. I got a chance to go swim in it.
7:54>> Oh, you did? I was going to ask you that.
7:56>> Yeah, I was >> How was that like?
7:57>> I went down with Robert Schoch and you know, my girlfriend Jenny and Hans and we got a chance to swim in it. The short it's one of the most beautiful lakes I've ever seen and I've I've hiked and traveled to a lot of beautiful lakes in the world, but I have to say Lake Van is arguably one of the most beautiful lakes I've ever been to.
8:12>> And there's like there's only one type of fish in it. So you're just it's almost like swimming through like a freshwater pond, but it's 1600 m deep or whatever.
8:21>> In fact, there's there's arguments that in they may have never found the true depth of the lake.
8:27Because I was talking to fishermen there and our tour guide, yeah, [laughter] who have depth sounded who have depth sounded the lake. They catch those pearl mullet nets.
8:39Yeah, there's Tauson and you can see there's >> There's like a lot of them. There's a lot of them there.
8:42>> huge schools of them, but there's it's the only fish in the lake. So you can see like the image of the underwater stuff under Lake Van.
8:51That's Tauson.
8:52>> Now how so Tauson's swimming there and I can see it looks like he has a light up above that. How do you know like how deep he got for something like that?
9:00>> Well, and that's what we can that's the big part of what we're going to get into is the depth. That's actually a really big part of this. It's important. So he Tauson is photographing in different parts of the lake, okay? He's checking he's doing photography of the the migrations of the pearl mullets in the spring when they spawn, right? They they flood the rivers and they're like jumping all over the place. It's quite a spectacle. The pearl mullets are not you know, they're not more than a foot long, but they're huge schools of them in the lake, okay? So he's photographing that as a nature documentary, but he's also photographing
9:33and filming the underwater areas, which by the way, there's been very little done under Lake Van. It's a very mysterious lake. So, he's filming off of Akdamar Island and in these different areas and there are a number of different ruins that are known about under Lake Van, but they're shallow.
9:50Well, he's diving off of a place called A Gji Gvez, which is in the northern part of Lake Van in 2017.
9:59And you can only dive in the lake for the first like 2 hours in the morning.
10:05Because once you get into the afternoon, the sunlight reflects off of all the salt and it makes it so you can almost not even see underwater.
10:12>> Mhm.
10:13>> So, you have this small window where you can actually dive. Okay, so he's diving off of A Gji Gvez, which is right in adjacent to Kef Kalesi, an ancient ancient megalithic site that I talked about on some of the other shows and I've subsequently gone to and we can talk about that as well.
10:30>> So, he's diving off of that and there are ruins down near the edge of the shoreline. But there'd never been anything done out underwater.
10:38So, he's underwater and he's diving and he gets down to 75 ft underwater.
10:4475 ft underwater. Unbelievably deep area, which, by the way, there's no underwater ruins in the world that are found that depth. Anywhere in the world, yes.
10:53>> If you go off of, like, for instance, there are underwater ruins in Lake Titicaca.
10:57>> Yeah.
10:57>> They're like 20, 30 ft at max.
10:59>> You're just talking about for lakes, though.
11:01>> No, for in oceans included.
11:03>> What about What about the the ruins that are off the coast of No, of Cuba?
11:08>> Well, that's not Okay.
11:10Hold on. We'll pause there for a second.
11:11That's not That may exist and there is a lot of evidence that supports that it does exist, but we don't have enough evidence yet. And I've talked I talked about that last time we were on.
11:23>> Yeah, I'm trying to remember the context cuz I just had NXT in here. We had a We had a long little segment in there where he was going through whether or not that could be true or not. So, I couldn't remember all the evidence, but okay.
11:35>> It's too deep for a that those ruins off of of Cuba are too deep for an actual diver to go to, right? They're 2,000 ft underwater, which means you need a submersible to get down there and look at them. Now, there that's a whole >> situation.
11:48>> Right.
11:48>> [laughter] >> That's a whole argument in itself of whether or not that's real. And I've I've talked about that on on before on episodes. It is very interesting. And more more exploration is needed to completely confirm that.
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13:49>> But in terms of confirmations, a place that like divers can get to and see that has been confirmed, these are by far, without a doubt, the deepest ruins anywhere in the world.
13:59>> See, I I don't want to make it sound less 75 Sometimes I [ __ ] feet and meters, so sorry if I did that earlier, but >> 23 m.
14:08>> So, 75 ft underground or or down below is is obviously deep. I don't want to make that sound like it's not deep. That doesn't sound like the deepest we'd ever find like that doesn't seem that deep for the deepest we'd ever find some ancient history artifacts.
14:23>> What Well, think about this for a minute.
14:25So, the the underwater ruins off of Alexandria, Egypt, and off of Greece, they're near the shoreline.
14:30>> Yes.
14:31>> Right? They're not We've never found any that are at a greater depth than that.
14:36And I'm going to give you some example.
14:37I'm not saying there has never been ruins that are deeper considering ocean level increases after the Younger Dryas, right? You get 400 ft increase in ocean ocean levels around a lot of parts of the earth. I'm sure there were underwater ruins, but they were they were never found or they were destroyed.
14:53>> To be clear, you're saying ruins that doesn't necessarily include like artifacts, though.
14:58>> No, I'm talking about actual substantial ruins of a civilization.
15:03>> Okay, that makes sense. Cuz I was going to say like the Antikythera mechanism that was found, the old 2,000-year computer, I believe that was found in the Mediterranean that had to be >> can sink from a shipwreck or something.
15:13>> Okay, so we're talking about >> same page.
15:15>> ruins, ex- extensive ruins, megalithic blocks. And that's the other part of this. Even the ruins that have been found in the world, they weren't megalithic. So, megalithic meaning large, finely cut blocks put together like precise, like we see in Lake Van area that I've talked about before. We see in Peru, Bolivia, and Egypt. Highly precise ancient ancient work.
15:42This not only is the only underwater megaliths in the world, but it's the deepest ruins anywhere in the world.
15:50>> And this guy just stumbled upon it.
15:51>> So, he was diving off of a Gigevez and he completely randomly found them.
15:59>> What did he think Have you talked with him about that?
16:02>> I talked with him. He's actually on the team. He's on the documentary team. I'm working directly with him and he's going to be leading us when we film at the end of June, early July to the ruins to go.
16:14>> What did he think it was when he first stumbled upon it?
16:17>> He just He saw it was the underwater ruins of a castle, they called it, and he reported it to and I can tell you the story after, but he reported it to the uh institutions and the Turkish government and they didn't believe him.
16:33>> Did he show them the pictures?
16:34>> And he's like, "Look at Look at all the pictures." And then he basically had it published in different magazines and it got some attention, but not nearly enough attention because it was labeled as being like a Urartian or a medieval later time period. But we're going to we can get into how not only is that grossly wrong, but it actually this could be one of the better examples of dating evidence of anywhere in the world.
17:00>> And why is that and what is our evidence for it?
17:03>> So, 75 ft is is a very very deep depth.
17:07If it's for the first question you'd have to ask is how could a lake a lake fluctuate by that much? This isn't the ocean. We're talking about a lake that's a long way from the ocean. How could you have depths fluctuate 80 to 100 ft?
17:21Because obviously, if it's found at 75 ft underwater, they would have been substantially less for a civilization to build on the edge of it. They're not going to build with a the waves lapping up against it, right?
17:32That wouldn't make sense. They would have to build, you know, at least a a little ways away from the edge of the shoreline.
17:38But so so that would have to mean that the lake was at least 80, if not 100 ft lower >> Mhm.
17:44>> when they built it. Okay?
17:45>> Mhm.
17:47>> Now, that creates a number of problems.
17:49It creates a number of problems because when we look at historic lake levels of Lake Van, there is nothing within the last 12,000 years that can account for those lake those that levels of that lake being that low.
18:05>> Mhm.
18:05>> It creates a very interesting scenario where we may have the the next best piece of evidence we have besides the weathering on the Sphinx that Robert Schoch had identified, which is you know, a big part of this cuz Robert Schoch is on the team.
18:20>> Yeah, that's amazing.
18:21>> Well, he's Well, he's We're going to call him an independent objective researcher on the team who is in investigating these sites. I don't want to put him under the category of he already has a predetermined um conclusion for this. I want to be very clear, he's an objective scientist exploring these sites with us.
18:40>> That's important.
18:41>> Yes. So, it doesn't mean any predetermined hypothesis or conclusions have already been determined. We are investigating anomalies and ancient ruins to determine whether or not they may be from a much earlier time period. Okay?
18:58>> Got it.
18:59>> So, Tauscher is underwater. He finds this extremely extensive area of megalithic ruins. It's over a kilometer in in area.
19:09Huge.
19:10>> Whoa.
19:10>> This is not just like >> It's like a town.
19:13>> Well, let me tell you why that's important. One of the considerations from geologists are like, "Well, what if this was a uh a set of ruins on the shoreline that like slid into the lake?"
19:24That's actually a hypothesis been that's been considered. If you have a geologic area of instability on the shoreline, you could get a like a a landslide where it sinks into the lake.
19:35>> How far into it was it though? Like how far >> half a mile from the shore.
19:39>> That's not po- I'm not an expert on this stuff.
19:42>> it's over a kilometer wide. You can't you would have to have like a small area sink in. You couldn't have like an entire almost a mile, you know, of >> To the common sense, that seems crazy. I agree.
19:53>> Right. So, they you he So, he goes and he he tells the Turkish government they don't they didn't believe him at the at first. How could that be possible? 75 ft underwater to have extensive extensive megalithic ruins of blocks that are over In In some cases, you know, over a foot wide. These are massive megalithic blocks that are very finely cut and put together. So, that's the first thing to pay attention to. Now, the second thing is that they they're not built out of what the Eurochians built with. So, the Eurochians built with limestone blocks.
20:31That's what I've postulated and talked about is that the tools available, Iron Age and Bronze Age tools, would would never be able to manipulate a harder stone. That's one of the arguments for the documentary and we're talking about because we see basalt, giant basalt blocks like at Kef Kalessi and others that are finely carved, and then we see limestone in associated with it. Now, the blocks underwater would never been able to survive if they were limestone. They would have got eaten away by the by the acidification or the by the underwater, you know, by the salt. It never would have been able to survive, but they're
21:05that's why we believe they're basalt, And that creates a whole 'nother animal itself because it adds in well how were they how were they created? You know, were they from what I'm considering is an earlier like an earlier time period is one of the arguments.
21:20>> So we haven't been able to take some sort of like sedimentary sample of this and test it.
21:26>> has been done yet. So when >> Well, Torsen dove down with he's a photographer.
21:31>> Yeah.
21:31>> He didn't even have an archaeologist.
21:33>> I know, but this is 2017. It's been 8 years.
21:35>> Yeah, nothing's happened since.
21:37>> So no one's going down there?
21:39>> No.
21:41We're going to be the first team of experts in the world that has ever gone down to analyze, study it, and potentially take samples if we get permits. We have to >> If you get permits, how does that work?
21:54>> we're going to be we're we're applying and getting we're working on getting all the permits necessary. That shouldn't be an issue. We're going to be doing this in a completely scientific way. We're not going to disturb anything. We're not going to touch anything. We're not going to cause any damage to the environment around it. We're simply going to be photo uh photographing and analyzing and and investigating these and looking at them um to potentially see that they may be from a completely lost time period of human civilization.
22:24And that because they're such an anomaly again, you you can't see that anywhere else in the world. It gives us a couple really unique um type of opportunities.
22:33The first is that the sediments have been relatively undisturbed. So we get a we have a chance to see something that has not been touched, that has not really been altered by anything, and really get a chance to review it. Second thing and we can we'll get into the symbols that are on some of the stones. But I want to bring up a really significant part of this that I think is is significant to dating evidence that we don't have.
23:02So, when a lot of people wish be easy enough we could date a lot of these structures around the world, you know, the argument is that well, is there a lost time period of human civilization around the world in which a culture that no longer exists built giant megalithic structures and and temples all around across the planet that was wiped out during the catastrophes during the last ice age of the Younger Dryas, right?
23:26>> Which is what, like 11,000 something years >> 11,600 years ago or so. And that's the argument that a lot of you'll call them alternative researchers have postulated and put forth.
23:35>> Yeah.
23:35>> And you know, we've talked to others a lot. We've talked about it. You know, Robert Schoch was brought into the Sphinx enclosure because John Anthony West saw what he believed and other experts had believed was water weathering and not wind erosion, right?
23:49>> Yes.
23:49>> And that was one of the arguments put forth that look, the Sphinx was actually built by an earlier culture before the dynastic Egyptians because it's water erosion and Egypt hasn't had any rain and that's substantial enough in the last 12,000 years.
24:01>> Yeah.
24:02>> So, there's already this position and Graham Hancock did a great job with his his Netflix series season 1 and 2 of Ancient Apocalypse. I don't know if you've seen it yet.
24:12>> I've seen a lot of season 1.
24:13>> He did a great job. I give him props for that. Thank you for laying that foundation down. You know, Randall Carlson, Graham Hancock, John Anthony West, Robert Schoch, Robert Bauval, there's so many names that I could say.
24:25Props to all of you guys. Thank you so much for laying such a great foundation down of us exploring what potentially could be a much earlier and sophisticated lost time period of human history.
24:36>> Has it hit you yet that someone like you who's been a real student of the game for so many years, who wanted to learn more, just started with your own curiosity and worked your way into being an expert, that now you are potentially sitting here on the precipice of being able to go in with an official team that you're in charge of to do an excavation of sorts on something that could change the way we view a certain part of history in really towards the middle of the earth right there.
25:09>> Yeah, I feel extremely blessed very very very appreciative that I have been able to take a lot of this research and a lot of this passion and that I've done in writing to a completely different level. One that's never frankly has never been done. We've never had a team of academics and top experts in their field truly going and investigate these in a scientific objective way to to finally create something where we can say, "Look, we have evidence to support that there may this lost human chapter of human civilization is real."
25:44And that it has been overlooked and has been something that the narrative may needs to strongly consider is that the story of human civilization is more complex and more mysterious than we've been told.
25:57>> Now, what are you when you get down there, what are you most looking for?
26:01Like what are the top three-ish type things that you're going to be trying to identify?
26:05>> So, what we're going to be doing is we are going to be identifying the type of stone that has been used to build these.
26:11That's a really really big deal. Um again, we have it gets back to understanding the Mohs hardness scale.
26:17If you have stone that is of a hardness of six or seven, which is basalt, it's a type of volcanic stone, tools the tools you have available for a civilization and the capabilities of that civilization come in come in they matter. They really come into hand because it's not that easy just to create a giant megalithic temple. The amount of work and people involved and calculations and everything involved is not simple. It's a great undertaking and you have to have a civilization that has reached a certain level to be able to do that. It's not It's not easy. It's a nomadic tribe of hunter-gatherers or
26:53primitive kind of warlike people would not be able to create great works of art through stone. It cuz it is art. It's It's beautiful. To create stones that are so tightly fit together that you can't even put a piece of paper between them.
27:05>> It's incredible.
27:06>> And then carve seamlessly beautiful beautiful motifs and symbols into them even cross-fitting on the stones between them.
27:14>> Cross-fitting on the stones?
27:15>> C- Cutting it Some of the Some of the That's what this is another fascinating aspect of this is that Ayanis, one of the sites Ayanis Kalesi on the banks of Lake Van, has symbols carved between the stone fitting.
27:28So, which is wild to think about. If So, if you're carving with a chisel and you're like and you're trying to put that in, how would you seamlessly carve with razor-sharp edges, laser almost laser-like cuts seamlessly between two blocks that fit together? How would you do that?
27:45>> With a chisel? I don't I don't see the possibility there.
27:49>> That's the problem is at these sites, especially Ayanis, we see this extremely fine andesite basalt stonework that is, again, beautiful. Some of the Some of the arguably the finest Some of the finest megaliths in the world in terms of how they're polished and put together and seamless.
28:07And in that way we we see these the where the where the fittings are, where the blocks come together very very precisely, there are symbols carved right between the overlaps where the blocks come together in a completely seamless way. So, when you look at I don't know if Alessi can pull something up. Can you look up Ayanis Kalesi for me?
28:31I I can show you an example of this.
28:33>> please. I was just going to ask.
28:37Curious what this looks like. Yeah.
28:39>> A Y A N I S And then Kalesi K A L E S I, yeah.
28:48>> Okay.
28:49>> It'll be Yeah, yeah.
28:50>> be able to find it and I'll I'll give you some I just want to give some examples of this as we're talking about it because I think it really is easily All right, the one right in the center.
28:58Right down.
29:00Right Right to left. Right there. By the way, that's me on the one of the picture to the right of you. See that?
29:04>> I did not see that. Um can we zoom in on that, Alyssa?
29:07>> There's a perfect example. Now, scroll above the altar and go right into the cross.
29:11>> Yes.
29:12>> Go right in there tight.
29:14Right in there.
29:16>> That's the best we got.
29:17>> Okay.
29:18So, take a look at these symbols carved in. You can see a griffin on the left.
29:22You can see some of the symbols of Haldi and then some of the crosses.
29:25>> The pine cone type figure, yeah.
29:28>> Now, look at how the symbols are carved between the blocks fitting together.
29:33It's it to do that >> Oh.
29:37>> And there's and they're so seamless that they don't even they're not even off-fitted. Like, they're not even like off by a even a >> Not. It's like perfect.
29:47>> How would you do that with modern tools or or ancient tools, I should say. How would you be able to seamlessly cut these symbols out of, by the way, one of the hardest stone on Earth. This is what's called andesite. It's even harder than basalt. They're both volcanic, but andesite is a type of metamorphosized volcanic rock that is 7 1/2 on the Mohs hardness scale out of 10.
30:10One of the hardest stones on Earth. Look at how precisely these symbols are carved. And by the way, that is what's called the sun cross in the center, which becomes the Knights Templar cross and the red cross we see in the night We've talked about it in the Vatican and others, which is very peculiar.
30:26But, that's what I'm talking about is On the left side, you can see what I think is like an hourglass figure next to the griffin. Those symbols are carved seamlessly into blocks that are fitted together.
30:38Now, the only way to do do in my mind is if Hit back once, you can see a couple other examples. But it the only way you could do that is to have the blocks already put together and then carve it into them.
30:54Right? Because if you were to carve two symbols into the two into blocks like that, how would you then fit them together to have them align perfectly?
31:03Right? It wouldn't >> It It It would be too hard.
31:05>> It would be too difficult.
31:06>> And so, yeah, I mean, we can this picture right here is so like HD, you can see it even better.
31:12>> And look at the Griffin on that one block, right?
31:14>> lining is insane.
31:17>> So, that's what we're talking about is number one, how could an Iron Age The Huartians were an Iron Age civilization.
31:24Which they only had Iron Age tools available to them. 2,800 BC.
31:29How would they have been able to cut and create symbols out of that kind of stone, which by the way, we don't even know where some of these quarries Geologists have have identified some of the quarries where these blocks came from. Some of them are over 200 miles away.
31:47One of them is is speculated to be 400 miles away.
31:52>> Woah.
31:52>> Because of the type of basalt and andesite, it's it's it's insane how we don't even know how they cut, moved them. But then once they put them in place, how could they get seamless symbols and motifs cut out of them? You know what it looks like? People have told me, it looks like almost like cookie cutters.
32:09>> Yes.
32:09>> It's like a 3D printer or something, right? If you had something that was like you stick it right in, boop, it's like clay or something and it comes out.
32:18Now, that brings up the question of whether or not these rocks were super heated.
32:22>> That's what I was going to ask. So, if if but if they do that and they're so massive, like obviously if they're heated at that kind of level, it's like if you touch it, you're going to burn. I >> It's mysterious. If anything, it would be to the point where I don't even know outside of laser type of tools, if we could even do this today.
32:42With that kind of precision, a stone mason, like give me an example. There have been stone masons that have brought into Tiwanaku brought into Tiwanaku and Puma Punku in Bolivia, which also has laser-like cut edges and symbols, just very similar to this. In fact, we're going to see talk about a lot of parallels to that today. They've been brought into that and they're like, I couldn't do this. I don't know any stone mason that could do this by hand. Maybe with some kind of a a technology, like a some kind of a laser-like technology, but it it brings up the question is if we could barely do it or not do it, how
33:17could a bronze an iron age civilization from 2800 BC do this?
33:22>> Mhm.
33:23>> And that's really where the question comes in.
33:26And I want to um Alessi, can you go back once? I just want to show another example before we move on to get to some other stuff.
33:34Okay, right there. Just leave it there for a minute. Now, we've talked about this before, but I want to bring it up one more time. All of that brown dirt you see on top of the andesite.
33:43>> And for people listening not watching, we're back on the original image we had of all the of all the same crosses that are carved into this.
33:49>> That is not actually dirt.
33:52All of the brown material above the stone is actually eroded mud brick.
33:57Okay?
33:57>> Mud brick?
33:58>> Mud brick. So, the Aymarans primarily build out of what's called mud brick, where they would take mud and and types of soil material and they would basically create bricks out of them, let them sit out in the sun, they harden, right? And then they would build with them. And that none of that is actually dirt. It's eroded mud brick. Now, if they built 2800 years ago with the mud brick and it eroded to that level, how imagine those blocks being on that level of of being precise still and not eroded. Imagine the difference there first of all. Now, archaeologists claim that this is a building style. Now, and I
34:44would agree it is a style some some places around the world. A culture or even today you'll build you'll see Roman Greco and other things where they build out of stone and they have something like something more lighter on top and cuz they you need a foundation that is stronger, okay? That's the argument that they use that the Urartians built with stonework on the bottom and then mud brick above it on top. Because these were all incorporated into castles. That's what the word "kalessi" means. They're castles. And they were castles, but that doesn't mean they originally were castles.
35:18Okay, that's the thing that really needs to come across here is that the any civilization we see around the world adopts ancient sites. They know it's important. They often will start like incorporate symbols into their culture from another ancient site. We see it all around the world. They'll adopt a site and then build right on top of it. It happens all the time. The Romans are famous for building on top of older foundations of structures. We see that in Baalbek, Lebanon all the time.
35:45So, what we're what is being laid out right now is that archaeologists are saying the Urartians built this unbelievable andesite on the bottom with these stonework and then built primitive mud work on mud brick right on top of it. And that's what it where it was everywhere.
36:00But, the problem is that it doesn't really make sense. And the only reason why they're saying that is because there's cuneiform writing written into some areas of these temples and these structures. Cuneiform. So, we see the wedge-like cuneiform design into the outer part of Ionian when you first come in.
36:20However, that's the only piece of evidence and there's no other evidence they're using to back it up. Because if you translate this Urartian cuneiform, it talks about like rulers like Rusa the Second and other rulers who have wrote in like, "Oh, this temple was was built was They don't even say they built it.
36:40They just say this temple is is is built in honor or whatever it is. But they don't say anything about the original foundations or anything. But they they claim ownership of these sites, okay?
36:50And for a certain dynasty or time period, that is the only evidence that archaeologists are using to say that who built it. Is the cuneiform. Except there's a problem.
37:01Throughout Egypt, we have evidence from say Rams the Ramsey culture and other dynastic Egyptians that they would write and carve hieroglyphics into other existing structures and claim ownership for them. Right? That's one of the arguments for the Sphinx is that it was a recarved and it was originally not that the same head.
37:21Well, that's the same problem we have here is that the Urartians and it's a famous It's a thing that is very common in the ancient world is trying to take credit for something because you want to seem greater and more majestic. And I postulate that all the cuneiform, all of it, is from the Urartians and that this mysterious civilization that built this left no writings at all behind. None.
37:45We see the same thing in Egypt is there's no writings left behind from like the build the builders of the Great Pyramid of Egypt of Giza.
37:52>> Yeah.
37:52>> There's no writings.
37:53>> in here and going through a bunch of that timeline is crazy.
37:57>> It's It's a There's no writings anywhere inside the Great Pyramid at all. There's one something scribbled that is supposedly scribbled with Khufu's name that is very likely a forgery that's been talked about from the 1800s. It's a whole story that you can get into, but there's no writings anywhere in any of those. In fact, most megalithic structures around the world, for instance, Peru and Bolivia, there's no writings in any of the megaliths anywhere there. I just got back from Peru. There's not one place where there's writings like in it, okay? Same with Egypt, the blocks don't have writings. So, here we have beautiful
38:34megalithic work around Lake Van with writings that are sporadic in a couple places.
38:40But, most of them have nothing on them.
38:42And so, the argument that I'm putting forth is that the Urartians came forward and had a war-like culture and they were there fighting the Assyrians like crazy back and forth. They, through their own wanting to be a superior civilization and showing their dominance, they put their names and their taking they took credit >> Took credit for >> for an earlier civilization that built these and they put their cuneiform into it.
39:07>> So, and that's where we get like they build the castle on top of what >> Exactly.
39:11>> Yeah.
39:11>> And then they incorporate the existing structures into their culture. Whereas, if we look at the capabilities of the Urartians through their art, pottery, what they were doing, they severely lacked any of the capability in my mind is if from everything I've studied and other archaeologists have put forth and have talked about as well is that they just it doesn't match any of their other building styles. You can see other Urartian building styles with crude stonework and mud brick and it doesn't match that time period at all. It just doesn't.
39:42>> So, it's an outlier and there would have to be something unforeseen in the capabilities of their civilization or in the stylistic culture or whatever of their civilization for this to actually be attributed to them completely from where the base was.
39:54>> If you take out the cuneiform, there's no evidence that the Urartians built it at all. None.
40:00>> And so, that's where we get into is whether or not they just carved cuneiform into some of these structures to take credit for them like Shavushtepe, like Ionis. We see a lot of examples of that around the world as I said of of cultures adopting and trying to take ownership of something that they didn't actually build.
40:18>> Sure.
40:19>> Now, let's get back to Lake Van.
40:22>> Yes, because I originally opened up this tangent with asking about the main, you know, three, five things, whatever it is, that you're going to be looking for going down there.
40:30>> So, the stonework.
40:31>> Yeah.
40:31>> All right, that was a long side side part tangent to talk about the stonework. When you go down under Lake Van, you see highly precise stonework, just like we see above the water at Iğdır, Çavuştepe, Kef Kalesi, Ayanis, Atepe, Toprakkale, all their other sites where you see beautiful, beautiful stonework at the basis of these with basalt and andesite where it's finally cut and polished. And we see the same thing underwater, okay? And that's So, that's a one that's the first thing we bring up is that it has the same kind of architecture. Now, the the big thing about the next piece of evidence I want to bring up is for
41:08dating.
41:09>> Mhm.
41:09>> And then we can talk about the symbols that are carved in the stone.
41:11>> Yes, we'll get there.
41:13>> I think that the dating potential in the Lake Van creates a scenario that is unusual anywhere in the world.
41:19First thing is that you can't date stone above water.
41:23It gets extremely affected by the the environment of weathering and other environments. The only reason Göbeklitepe was able to be dated is because it was buried.
41:32>> Yes, buried.
41:33>> Okay, so then they were able to go in and carbon date the organic material in the cracks of that. Now, some of that could be possible at some of these sites if they do it right because we have evidence that Kef Kalesi and Iğdır was buried as well.
41:48Evidence that the Urartians buried it because they were being invaded and it was being potentially going to be destroyed by other cultures and they knew it was important. And so, like Iğdır was a giant hillside mound on top and they found evidence that not only was it either potentially either deliberately um basically, it was like a castle on top that it was um broke uh not broken in but basically collapsed in on itself and then and then buried on top of that with a very thick layer up to five or sometimes even 10 feet of material that was then put on top.
42:26So the amount of work necessary to bury these would have been enormous but you would have done that if you wanted to preserve them. So that is what we found is that that possibly could be another avenue with some of the soil and some of the dating done on this and I'm in talks with Robert Schoch on whether or not that's something we're going to be pursuing with some of these sites as well.
42:45>> And because it's in the lake you can actually do it in a more verifiable way.
42:50>> You have but the potential of soil sampling core sampling of soil that is different with an undisturbed underwater situation than you do above ground and so that's something that's possible in the future but let me bring up the big one here.
43:05It's a big one.
43:06>> Mhm.
43:07>> Again, how do you date any of this then besides what I just said? That's a you don't get much more than that. You get some some types of organic dating if you if you have it available based on the scenario. And then there's like vitrification of melting of rock that we have we we identified that's another possibility to do some dating on.
43:25But the big one here is this.
43:29So as I mentioned these this this underwater ruins at Lake Van are 75 feet underwater which means that Lake Van would have had to fluctuate at least 80 feet to be able to have these exposed above water. Now Lake Van is a what's called a closed basin system.
43:46Meaning that it doesn't have any rivers that leave it.
43:50Okay? So it has rivers coming in and then nothing leaves. The only way that water can leave the lake is through evaporational cooling.
43:57There's no other way.
43:58>> of the flow of the river you're saying.
44:00>> And so but the problem is that it wasn't always like that.
44:05Lake Van used to have a river that exited it.
44:08In the southwest part of the river, there's a river called the Murat River, m u r a t, that used to exit the lake and it was the only river that exited the lake.
44:17Now, if you imagine climatically in the last 12,000 years, if you're going to try to discuss how a lake can fluctuate its water levels, you would be like, "Oh, well, it went through different periods of rain and then less rain and less snow, right? And then dry periods." Well, that would only be able to fluctuate the lake a few hundred meters at most.
44:41Right?
44:42>> Yeah.
44:42>> feet, not 80 feet. That would be That would be something beyond any kind of mega drought to be able to do something like that, especially in a region that doesn't have those kinds of droughts.
44:54So, I was doing research and I stumbled across something very significant that actually may change this whole ballgame.
45:02That and I think it's one of the ways that we could have some what you call a smoking smoking gun piece of evidence.
45:09>> And what is that?
45:09>> That joins Robert Schoch's and John Anthony West's what water water weathering of the Sphinx enclosure.
45:17When you look at historic records of Lake Van, there's an anomaly you can find.
45:21There is a volcano on the southwest part of Mount of Lake Van called Mount Nemrut, not to be confused with the other Mount Nemrut that's more in central Turkey.
45:31It is one of the largest volcanic calderas in the world. It's enormous.
45:37And in fact, Alexander the Great, when he traveled to to that region, they visited that and they talked about it.
45:45Xerxes the Great visited this region, too. It was a It was an ancient region.
45:49We've talked about the biblical connections to the sons of Noah and this whole Ararat civilization thing that may be may tie into this mysterious civilization. So, other cultures were coming here like as tourists to see it.
46:03In fact, in in Van, there's a inscription carved out of the stone in a place called Tuşpa, the castle in Van, from Xerxes the Great.
46:11>> Mhm.
46:12>> That's in that. So, they were visiting this place. Anyway, in the southwest part of the lake, as I mentioned, is a massive volcano that has an eruption that was so big that it altered that entire region. Literally, the entire mountain blew up.
46:27>> Hey guys, if you haven't already subscribed, please hit that subscribe button. It's a huge, huge help. Thank you.
46:32>> And it it has a volcanic crater, a a caldera that is miles across. It's enormous.
46:40Now, when when you look at data of this volcano, you find out that it's been extremely studied because it's one of the better calderas in the world, the bigger and more like older and more well-studied. And so, you look at the dating, and they've gone in, and they've done cores into the volcano, and they've studied the hell out of it. So, we have a bunch of data from the volcano, which is interesting because it gives us the scientific evidence we need to help potentially prove the dating of this civilization. Let me tell you why.
47:12When you look into the records of what they found with this volcano, is they found out that the volcano has had its last major eruption. So, the one where it blew its top off, right, scattered stuff all over Van, happened right at the end of the Younger Dryas.
47:29>> Ooh.
47:30Convenient.
47:31>> Right at the end of the Younger Dryas, around 11,000 to 12,000 years ago, somewhere in there. 12, maybe 13, somewhere in that time period, the Younger Dryas, okay? So, they know that that's when it had last had its its major eruption. There has been little minor ones since then, but usually volcanoes kind of burp a little bit, you know, over time, but not not a major one. So, what happened was, you find out that they have great geologic records of this, that when Mount Nemrut exploded, its debris, cuz it's right next to the Murat River. The Murat River's only a couple miles away, blocked off the access outlet of the
48:09Murat River from Lake Van, the only river that exits Lake Van.
48:14Blocking it off and basically completely separating it from the lake, creating a closed based closed basin system where no water could leave Lake Van again.
48:24Now, if you have a bathtub, I'm going to give the bathtub analogy, and you are filling the bathtub with water, meaning rivers coming in, right?
48:32Cuz there's big rivers that flow into Lake Van. And you have a a plug that's partially open.
48:38You're going to have the water come in and but some leaves. So, you're going to have a somewhat consistent level of water that fluctuates a little bit, right? Based on how much you put in.
48:47But, some's always going to leave.
48:48That's That's how lakes work, right?
48:50That's how you fluctuate the lake. What happens if you plug it up?
48:54Boom, you put the plug in.
48:56What happens?
48:58It all of a sudden fills up with an enormous amount, doesn't it?
49:04Well, how else could you account for 80 to 100 ft of of lake depth change to then flood over ancient civilization ruins and then put it somewhere? You now have dating from a geological event that occurred that specifically blocks off the only outlet that would have allowed water to leave, keeping us a steady flow in that lake, to then flood it over, and you have geological dating proving when that event occurs.
49:33>> Which means that this is older than that event.
49:36>> Exactly.
49:36>> Wow.
49:38>> Which means that we now have what may be the best tangible evidence, or some of the best we've ever had, to prove that these are lost civilization evidence before the Younger Dryas.
49:48>> How old again do they say Göbekli Tepe >> 11,800 >> years old.
49:54>> Okay, so also right in that strike zone.
49:57>> time period, but that's the dating they get and maybe older than that. It just means that that's the organic Well, it means that that's that's the age of the organic matter that was on that crevice.
50:08It doesn't mean that that's when the stones were built.
50:11You see what I'm saying? That's that's like saying, well, we know it's at least 11,800 years old.
50:16Because you can't you can't date stone.
50:19So, you're Like just like we're saying here, well, we know this geologic event happened where it blocked off the Murat River and then raised like Von flooding over these ruins. We know it's at least 12,000 years old.
50:30>> Yes, but it could be way older.
50:31>> Exactly. Exactly. It could be way older than that. So, this is a very exciting because we have scientific evidence now that is very extensive that is really adding up to a smoking gun potentially of changing this entire narrative.
50:50>> And when are So, you have to get the permits and everything. When are you looking to do this?
50:53>> We're going to be diving down with Torsun, who is the one who discovered these underwater ruins. We're going to be going with a whole team at the end of June, early July.
51:03>> That's coming up. And what was the the other thing you were you said you hinted at you were going to be looking for is the symbolism? On the rocks, right?
51:10>> one of the things that that he found when he went down there is that not only does it have the same type of stonework and and the type of stone that would be is important to understand, but there is a very set of prominent symbols carved into the top of these blocks. And that is the flower of life.
51:30This giant six-figured um spoke I'll call them spokes flower of life, which is very important, that number of spokes, because that's going to tie into numerology and this motif around the world that we're going to talk about and symbols that connect to all the stuff above that we're going to get into as well.
51:49>> And for people who aren't familiar, who haven't heard on previous podcasts and stuff, can you explain the flower of life and what that is and what its history is?
51:57>> So, the flower of life is a type of symbol that has been used by ancient cultures throughout history. It's one of the most common motif symbols we find. I think that one of the best examples for it we can see in in ancient times is if we go to the Osirion in Abydos, Egypt.
52:13And in the Osirion is this massive subterranean area that is built out of these huge granite columns that are many many multi-ton granite columns that are is a very mysterious place because there's primitive limestone built above it. Just like we talked about with different cultures building on top of older existing things.
52:34And down in the Osirion, you can see these numerous patterns that have been carved into the rock of this six-spoked flower of life. Now, why six?
52:46Well, the flower of life is basically the way that you would embody and show the intelligent design of life in the entire universe.
52:55And let me get into why I made that statement.
52:58>> So, this gets into Nikola Tesla.
53:01So, Nikola Tesla, he has this famous quote. He says basically if you want to un- uncover the mysteries of the universe, it's found within the numbers 3, 6, and 9.
53:13He realized that there was a repeating pattern of the of life everywhere all on Earth. If you see it the the the designs of like a honeycomb or the designs of the flowers and patterns everywhere, it it follows and mimics this design of 3, 6, and then 9. It's basically your It's a repeating pattern of life. It's a life pattern.
53:35And it's it's possible evidence to also discuss the idea of an intelligence that for our universe as well. It's like a pattern, it's like a blueprint. It's a blueprint of the creation of life in the universe. Now, the reason three is the first number is that three is is the first most simplistic number where you can create a triangle.
53:54>> Yes.
53:55>> Right? And so it gets into we get into you know, the tetrahedron and all of that, right?
54:01>> Can't close a shape without at least three.
54:03>> And so it's we're talking about this type of pattern-like design that mimics life, the creation of life everywhere in the universe. And that pattern that he had identified as being like a blueprint. Okay?
54:16>> Do you know how he came across this and when he did?
54:19>> Using um when he was doing cymatic types of uh projects. Do you know what cymatics is?
54:25>> No.
54:26>> Cymatics is when you use electricity using playing with the magnetism of the earth and it creates like these designs. It's like plasma type of electric electric electric city designs. And it creates us this cymatics and I'm not an expert on this, I just want to point out. There's people that could talk much more extensively about this than I could. But it basically is a way of seeing patterns that are designed based on electromagnetic forces and magnetism and it creates patterns. Like there's already this natural inherent pattern that comes from energetics that then is in that it's embodied through physical
55:01things, right? Shells and fossil shells and flowers and other things. It's a type of design that has to do with the creation of life and how life mimics this pattern. And he determined that through his experimentation with um with plasma and and through with electricity and magnetism. And that's where you get down that whole rabbit hole of free energy and understanding that there's an energetic force that has to do with the magnetism of the earth and all this thing these things, right?
55:30Well, getting a little away from that it's we find that pattern was known about by the ancients. They knew about this pattern of creation. Yes.
55:41>> How do we know that?
55:43>> Because they when we look at all of these symbols, you look at every single symbol that we're looking at except for one, the cross. Cross is more of a totality symbol. But you look at the step pyramid design, there's always three levels to it. Every time we go around the world, whether or not it's Peru and I just got back looking at it. For instance, there's a place called the spring of the Nusta in Ollantaytambo has three levels to it. You can also go across just down the road from it to a place called Napa Glacia. There's these doorways that are like false doorways and there's always three levels every
56:17time.
56:19Anytime you see these ancient motif designs, you see this type of pyramid-like three-level pyramid design or three-level kind of entranceway. Like for instance, if you look at the Gate of the Sun at Tiwanaku and Puma Punku, there's a doorway there. If you look at the backside of that, there are three levels to that. Just like Viracocha is that's that's depicted on that is standing on a platform with three levels.
56:44>> Mhm.
56:45>> Okay?
56:46So you get this repeating pattern over and over and over again. They show three over and over everywhere. And then they see that you see the pattern of the flower of life which is six. And then you get these three-level step pyramids like on the Kef Bar relief. Three pyramids, nine. Right? 3 + 3 + 3.
57:07>> Every single time you look at the motifs and designs they had, they were mimicking this pattern of creation in the universe.
57:14Like they already understood it. And this gets down into this this whole discussion of whether or not this lost time period of human history, this these incredible cultures, the reason they were able to build the things that they were, these magnificent megalithic megalithic things that that have no idea how they move them, how they carve them, any of these questions of how they did these things they did.
57:36It comes down into, well, did It comes down to the question of, well, did they understand physics and aspects of the energetics and designs woven into our universe that Nikola Tesla stumbled upon?
57:49That's really what this conversation is about is whether or not there was already something known that it's not like he invented it, it's like he found it again.
57:58>> Yes.
57:58>> Through what was already Yeah, rediscovered it from what was already known.
58:02And they may help us to understand the capabilities of this lost civilization to do the things that they were doing because they understood these fundamental key things of not only the Earth but the universe.
58:16>> But if something's like that simple, that it's amazing, but it strikes me as a as something that they could have figured out just looking at physical patterns around them as opposed to putting it to work, say, totally tech- technologically. And when I say technologically, I'm referring more to like what we have now, like computers and things like that. Technically, everything is technology, like when you're building something or something like that. So, let's keep it simple, but they may have been looking at those things on a simplistic level and possibly discovered something that is insanely accurate and points to
58:49scientific underlying scientific discoveries yet to be made after them that could help us go down the right track in that way. Whereas, when Tesla was looking at it, and I hope this is making sense to people out there. But when Tesla's looking at it, he's now at a point where we've advanced more in human history. He's working on things that are highly complex and would have been viewed as insane magic by those previous civilizations, and he's able to more advance that into more of a modern version of the theory while taking the base case that they figured out. Meaning, they weren't more advanced than where he is, but they did
59:23have certain things figured out that were ahead of their time, if you will.
59:27>> Okay, I'll give you some examples for why I think it's more complex than they knew more than that.
59:33First of all, we have this premonition that's been very much established into our mindsets, that if it's old, it's primitive.
59:42That's often something that is Oh, wow, that's that's that's really old, so that must be or that's primitive, so it must be old, right?
59:49>> And I think that that is the first place we need to try to separate, is to say, well, >> Wait a minute.
59:55>> Yes, everything in the last few thousand years, like Stonehenge and other things, they're more primitive, older designs. I agree.
60:06But when we're looking at this time period of what the the things that we're looking at right now in like like Fawn, around the Osirion, around parts of Peru and Bolivia, we may be looking at a completely different chapter of human civilization in which they knew things and understood things that even we don't know today.
60:24>> Thank you guys for checking out this clip. If you haven't already subscribed, please subscribe and hit the like button on this video. It is a huge, huge help.
60:31And if you'd like to check out this clip's full podcast episode, that link is in the description below or right here. And finally, you can follow me on Instagram and X by using the links in my description below.
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